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Ðàçíîå Ëþáûå ñîîáùåíèÿ íà ìåäèöèíñêèå òåìû, ïî êîòîðûì íåò îòäåëüíûõ ôîðóìîâ. Ôîðóì: ×àñòíàÿ ïðàêòèêà.

Çàêðûòàÿ òåìà
 
Îïöèè òåìû Ïîèñê â ýòîé òåìå Îïöèè ïðîñìîòðà
  #1426  
Ñòàðûé 12.10.2003, 10:10
Zhivov Zhivov âíå ôîðóìà
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 20.08.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,792
Zhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
×òî êàñàåòñÿ ÎÒ è ëå÷åíèè òîãî æå õð. ïðîñòàòèòà â ÑØÀ. Òî ÿ âåäü íèêîãäà íå ññûëàþñü íà áåçûìÿííûå èñòî÷íèêè. Ïðèõîäèëîñü ñëûøàòü ìíåíèå ðóêîâîäèòåëÿ Oasis Hospital, ñ êîòîðûì ñâÿçûâàþò äåëîâûå îòíîøåíèÿ:
Êàê Âàì íå ñòûäíî, Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷!!!??? Ãîâîðèòü î ëå÷åíèè ïðîñòàòèòà â ÑØÀ îïèðàÿñü íà ñëîâà ìåêñèêàíñêîãî æóëèêà!!! Âî-ïå6ðâûõ ó Âàñ ÷òî ñ ãåîãðàôèåé ïðîáëåìû? Âî-âòîðûõ êàêîå îòíîøåíèå èìååò ê ïðîáëåìå ïðîñòàòèòà ýòîò øàðëàòàí êîèìè ïåðåïîëíåíà Ìåêñèêà. È ÏÎÒÎÌ ÈÇ ÅÃÎ ÏÈÑÜÌÀ ÑËÅÄÓÅÒ ÒÎËÜÊÎ, ×ÒÎ ÎÍ ÑÎÁÈÐÀÅÒÑß ÑÄÅËÀÒÜ ÍÀ ÂÀØ Ñ×ÅÒ ÏÐÅÄÎÏËÀÒÓ È ÊÓÏÈÒÜ ÂÀØ ÎÇÎÍÀÒÎÐ, ÍÅ ÁÎËÅÅ ÒÎÃÎ. Ïðî ïðîñòàòèò òî òàì íè÷åãî íåò!!! Àé-ÿ-ÿé, Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷. Åñëè õîòèòå ïîëó÷èòü èíôîðìàöèþ ïî ñîñòîÿíèþ ïðîáëåìû ïðîñòàòèòà ñåãîäíÿ ïîèùèòå â ìåäëàéíå íà èìåíà John Curtis Nickel è Roger Kirby, ýòè àâòîðû (îñîáåííî ïåðâûé) î÷åíü ìíîãî ïèøóò ïî ïðîáëåìå.

×òîáû Âû íå ïîäóìàëè, ÷òî ÿ ãîëîñëîâíî îáâèíÿþ â øàðëàòàíñòâå Âàøåãî ïîòåíöèàëüíîãî ïîäåëüíèêà, ïðîñìîòðèòå ñëåäóþùèå ññûëêè:
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Èç ýòîé ññûëêè êñòàòè ñëåäóåò, ÷òî ïðàâèòåëüñòâåííûå îðãàíû ÑØÀ, Êàíàäû è Ìåêñèêè çàêðûëè íåêóþ øàðëàòàíñêóþ êëèíèêó â Òèõóàíå. Ìåêñèêà. Ýòî ÷àñîì íå Âàø ïîäåëüíèê ïîïàë?

[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
ß òóò ïðàâäà óçíàë, ÷òî Òèõóàíó íàçûâàþò â Ìåêñèêå ìåêêîé "àëüòåðíàòèâíûõ êëèíèê" è òàì èõ áîëåå 50. Òàê ÷òî ìîæåò áûòü ïîäåëüíèê óöåëåë.

[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

Ïðîäîëæèì ïîçæå. Îäíàêî ìû åùå ðàç èìåëè øàíñ óáåäèòüñÿ, ÷òî Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷ êîìïàíèþ ïîäáèðàåò ñåáå íå ñàìóþ ëó÷øóþ.
  #1427  
Ñòàðûé 12.10.2003, 15:41
Zhivov Zhivov âíå ôîðóìà
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 20.08.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,792
Zhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Î÷åíü õîðîøî èëëþñòðèðóåò êòî òàêîé Ýðíåñòî Êîíòðåðàñ è ÷òî çà èñòîðèÿ ñòîèò çà âèòàìèíîì Â-17 èëè Ëåòðèëîì.
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Òàê ÷òî íå òîëüêî ê îçîíó ïðîÿâèë èíòåðåñ èçâåñòíûé ìåêñèêàíñêèé æóëèê. Äîïîëíèòåëüíàÿ èíôîðìàöèÿ, ïîäòâåðæäàþùàÿ ôàêòî òîãî, ÷òî ëåòðèë - øàðëàòàíñòâî, à çíà÷èò è ä-ð Êîíòðåðåñ æóëèê ñîäåðæèòñÿ [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
È íåñìîòðÿ íà âñå ýòî ìåêñèêàíñêèå æóëèêè ïðîäîëæàþò èñïîëüçîâàòü Ëåòðèë â ñâîåé [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Òàê âîò êòî ÿâëÿåòñÿ êëèåíòîì Âëàäèìèðà ßêîâëåâè÷à. ×òî æ, îêàçûâàåòñÿ íàø ãëàâíûé ïî îçîíó íå òîëüêî ðàáîòû ñîîòâåñòâóþùåãî êà÷åñòâà öèòèðóåò, íî åùå è îòíîñèò ê àìåðèêàíñêèì êëèíèêàì ñîìíèòåëüíûå ó÷ðåæäåíèÿ èç Ìåêñèêè, ñòîëü ïå÷àëüíî èçâåñòíûå â ÑØÀ è äðóãèõ ñòðàíàõ. Ïîõîæå ðåïóòàöèÿ êëèåíòîâ íå î÷åíü çàáîòèò Âëàäèìèðà ßêîâëåâè÷à. Ãëàâíîå, ÷òîáû îçîíàòîðû ðàñêóïàëèñü ïîáîé÷åå.

Êîíå÷íî, îò÷àÿâøèåñÿ ïàöèåíòû, êîòîðûì âðà÷è ñêàçàëè, ÷òî èõ äíè ñî÷òåíû èäóò íà âñå. Äàæå ïëàòÿò ïî $ 15 000 çà êóðñ ëå÷åíèÿ ìàãíèòàìè íà ëîõîòðîííîì àïïàðàòå â òîé æå Ìåêñèêå. Äàæå âåñüìà îáðàçîâàííûå âðà÷è, â ÷èñëå êîòîðûõ ìîé êîëëåãà, íûíå ïîêîéíûé ïðîô. è çàâ. óðîëîãè÷åñêîé êàôåäðîé William Fair, M.D. èç NY Sloan Kettering Cancer Center ïûòàëèñü èñïîëüçîâàòü àëòåðíàòèâíóþ ìåäèöèíó äëÿ ëå÷åíèÿ âûÿâëåííîãî ó íèõ áåçíàäåæíîãî ðàêà. Îäíàêî, ê ñîæàëåíèþ, òùåòíî. Îò÷àÿíèå ýòèõ ëþäåé èñïîëüçóåòñÿ ìíîãèìè æóëèêàìè ìèðà äëÿ òîãî, ÷òîáû çàðàáîòàòü íà èõ òðàãåäèè.  èõ ÷èñëå, ê ñîæàëåíèþ, è ìåêñèêàíñêèé êëèåíò Âëàäèìèðà ßêîâëåâè÷à.
  #1428  
Ñòàðûé 12.10.2003, 21:16
V. ZAITSEV V. ZAITSEV âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.07.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,330
V. ZAITSEV
Àëåêñåé Âèêòîðîâè÷!

Èç ññûëêè, êîòîðóþ Âû ïðèâåëè
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

MODERATOR at 1:12 p.m. ET
Kali Ashcroft writes: .There are many cancer clinics in Mexico that are quite effective, but there are just as many if not more that are out to swindle you As a breast cancer survivor I should know. .I would be dead today if it were not for alternative medicine. . The clinics that you featured in your story must have been the bottom of the barrel because I haven't heard of any of them, or any of the treatments they use."
Òåïåðü èç ñàéòà «Oasis Hospital», ñ êîòîðûì ïîëàãàþ Âû óñïåëè ïîçíàêîìèòüñÿ.
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Also known as The Contreras Clinic, The Oasis of Hope Hospital has been treating cancer since 1963. It is run by Dr. Ernesto Contreras, M.D. and his son, Dr. Francisco Contreras, M.D. They have treated over 100,000 patients with a good success rate. The hospital is very clean and modern.
. The Oasis of Hope Hospital is a full-service facility with surgical, diagnostic, and intensive care capabilities.
Òåïåðü âîïðîñ, êàêîå îòíîøåíèå èìååò ýòà äîâîëüíî êðóïíàÿ è èçâåñòíàÿ êëèíèêà, â êîòîðîé èñïîëüçóþòñÿ êàê òðàäèöèîííûå, òàê è àëüòåðíàòèâíûå ìåòîäèêè ê òîé âîçíè, êîòîðóþ Âû òóò ñ òàêèì óäîâîëüñòâèåì, òîðæåñòâóþùå öèòèðóåòå è öèòèðóåòå? Êàê ìîæåò òðèäöàòü ëåò ñóùåñòâîâàòü, ðàçâèâàòüñÿ è ðàñøèðÿòüñÿ ËÓ, åñëè âñå âðà÷è êëèíèêè æóëèêè, à ìåòîäèêè øàðëàòàíñêèå?  êëèíèêå çà ýòè ãîäû òîëüêî ðàêîâûõ áîëüíûõ ïðîëå÷åíî áîëåå 100000 ÷åëîâåê, ïðè÷åì ñ êàæäûì ãîäîì êîëè÷åñòâî ïàöèåíòîâ óâåëè÷èâàåòñÿ. ×òî ÑØÀ ñòðàíà èäèîòîâ, êîòîðûå íåñìîòðÿ íà âñå îòðèöàòåëüíûå çà òðèäöàòü ëåò ñóùåñòâîâàíèÿ êëèíèêè ðåçóëüòàòû âñå åäóò è åäóò òóäà ëå÷èòüñÿ?
È ïî÷åìó Âû îïÿòü ñ âûñîêîìåðíîé ñàìîóâåðåííîñòüþ, â ñâîåé ìàíåðå, îêðåñòèëè âðà÷à, î êîòîðîì ïåðâûé ðàç ñëûøèòå - ìåêñèêàíñêèì æóëèêîì? Íàïîìèíàþ êðàòêèå ñïðàâî÷íûå äàííûå î íåì: Dr Ernesto Contreras, one of Mexico’s leading medical specialists, has operated the Oasis Hospital in Tijuana, Mexico for over 30 years, treating cancer patients with laetrile. Many of his patients have travelled from America where laetrile treatment is currently denied them by law. Dr Contreras received post-graduate training at the Harvard Children’s Hospital in Boston. He has served as the chief pathologist at the Army Hospital in Mexico City and was Professor of Histology and Pathology at the Mexican Army Medical School.
Âñå îñòàëüíûå âðà÷è êëèíèêè òîæå æóëèêè è øàðëàòàíû? Ïî÷åìó Âû ãðîìîãëàñíî ñîîáùàåòå ýòî íà ôîðóìå, ãäå îíè ýòè çàÿâëåíèÿ íå ìîãóò óâèäåòü? ß ìîãó ïðåäîñòàâèòü Âàì âîçìîæíîñòü ñîîáùèòü îá ýòîì èì ëè÷íî.
È, íàêîíåö, åñëè äàæå âñå àëüòåðíàòèâíîå äåéñòâèòåëüíî ïîëíîñòüþ íåýôôåêòèâíîå è øàðëàòàíñêîå, à ïàöèåíòû òîëïàìè ê íèì ñòðåìÿòñÿ, òî ýòî ëèøü õîðîøî õàðàêòåðèçóåò âîçìîæíîñòè òðàäèöèîííîé ìåäèöèíû ñ õèìèîëó÷åâîé òåðàïèåé è ñêàëüïåëåì.
ß íå õî÷ó, ïðîäîëæàòü çäåñü äèñêóññèþ ïî âèòàìèíó Â17, ò.ê., â îòëè÷èè îò Âàñ, íå áåðóñü ñóäèòü î òîì, ÷åãî íå çíàþ, íî êîå - êàêóþ ëþáîïûòíóþ èíôîðìàöèþ ìîæíî ïî÷åðïíóòü èç ñëåäóþùåé ñòàòüè:
Ìîæåò âñå æå ïîçíàêîìèòåñü?
Laetrile
Most people know about Laetrile the apricot pit, "cyanide filled" alternative cancer treatment that caused the FDA to raid health food stores and remove apricot pits from the shelves. Most people believed what the news media said about Laetrile. Recently, more anti-laetrile "news" has appeared. This information almost always points to the well-publicized Laetrile test conducted at Sloan-Kettering in the 1970s. The final report stated there was no evidence that Laetrile was effective. .However, employees inside Sloan-Kettering secretly sent copies of the actual lab reports to the press that proved just the opposite. The press ignored the truth; they didn't want to offend some large advertisers.
Dr. Ralph Moss, who was Assistant Director of Public Affairs at Sloan-Kettering, was one of the whistle-blowers. He was fired because of it. The Sloan report was an insult to truth and a prostitution of science, but it is still sighted as the major study that disproves Laetrile. Dr. Moss decided that the truth was too valuable so he fights for alternative cancer treatments to this day. To learn the numerous ways Laetrile was discredited, read The Cancer Industry by Ralph Moss. To see a ton of evidence of the trophoblast theory behind Laetrile as a cancer treatment and simple preventative, read the book World Without Cancer by Griffin. If you don't have time, at least order the video of World Without Cancer clearly the best video about an alternative cancer treatment. You can read a sample of the information in Griffin's book relating to the success rate of conventional treatment including chemo on a separate page of this web site.
Considering Chemo Before an Alternative Cancer Treatment?
.From the 12th December 2002 issue of Journal of the American Medical Association, in a review with James Spencer Malpas, M.D., D.Phil. St. Bartholomew's Hospital London, United Kingdom: "a recent randomized trial of treatment for stage one multiple myeloma by Riccardi and colleagues (British Journal of Cancer 2000;82:1254-60) showed no advantage of conventional chemotherapy over no treatment."
The above statement is in direct contrast to popular belief because of statements like this:
"1998 was truly one of the most exciting years for cancer research," said Harmon Eyre, MD, executive vice president for research and medical affairs for the American Cancer Society (ACS). "While we are closer than ever to finding answers..." followed by a pitch for more donations.
Another doctor's views on medical research in America.
Who is telling the truth?
.In 1986 McGill Cancer Center scientists surveyed 118 oncologist who specialized in lung cancer. They were asked if they would take chemo if they developed lung cancer. Three-quarters replied that they WOULD NOT TAKE CHEMO.

Taken from Reclaiming Our Health by John Robbins, 1996. Published by HJ Kramer, Box 1082, Tiburon, CA 94920.
In 1984 an unusual convention of doctors was held in Chicago. Nine eminent physicians from all over the United States spoke to an auditorium packed with their colleagues. .The name of the conference was Dissent in Medicine. The theme at the conference was the propensity of the nation's medical hierarchy to lie to the public. Among the speakers was Alan S. Levin, M.D., professor of immunology at the University of California, San Francisco, Medical School, "Practicing physicians are intimidated into using regimes which they know do not work. One of the most glaring examples is chemotherapy, which does not work for the majority of cancers."


P.S. ß â ïëîòíóþ íå áûë ñâÿçàí ñ èññëåäîâàíèÿìè ÎÒ â îíêîëîãèè, ïîýòîìó èçáåãàþ îá ýòîì âûñêàçûâàòüñÿ, íåñìîòðÿ íà öåëûé ðÿä îïóáëèêîâàííûõ ðàáîò. Òèïà:
OZ-PO-039: TUMOR pO2 MODIFICATION BY OZONETHERAPY.
B. Clavo (a), M. Lloret (a), L. López (a), G. Suárez (a), M. Santana (a), J.L. Pérez (b), V. Rodríguez (c), D. Macías (b), M.A. Hernández (a), R. Martín-Oliva (b), G. Rovira (d) and M Günderoth (e).
(a) Pino Hospital: Radiation Oncology-Research Unit, Las Palmas, (b) Pino Hospital: Medical Physics Unit., Las Palmas, (c) La Paterna Center, Las Palmas, (d) Quiron Clinic, Barcelona, Spain, (e) Helzel Medical Systems,Germany.
Hypoxic tumor cells are 2.5 - 3 times more resistant to radiotherapy, with higher metastatic potential than normoxic cells. Tumor hypoxia is an independent prognostic factor in head and neck and uterine cervix tumors. As has been demonstrated by the meta-analysis of Overgaard and the multicenter clinical trials, hypoxia modification prior to or during the course of radiotherapy can increase the effectiveness of treatment and improve prognosis. Ozonetherapy (O3T) has been used to treat ischemic disorders. This study evaluated the effect of O3T on tumor pO2 in humans. We study 16 patients with advanced or relapsed cancer: Male:Female 13 : 3, between 50 – 91 years old. O3T was carried out by autohemotransfusion 3 alternating days over one week. Tumour pO2 was measured by a polarographic probe system, four times. There were 150-200 determinations every time. During O3T there was significant increase (Friedman test: p = 0.013) in tumor oxygenation and decrease of hypoxic fractions, with prolonged effect. There was inverse and significant correlation between individual "Increase Factor" and "initial pO2 value": higher increase oxygenation in those initially worse oxygenated tumors (Spearman rho = - 0.885, p < 0.001. These findings support that ozone therapy could be a useful adjuvant in treatment of hypoxic tumors.

À îçîíîòåðàïåâòè÷åñêèå óñòàíîâêè, Åâãåíèé Åâãåíüåâè÷, â Oasis Hospital åñòü è íè îäíà.
Íî Dr Contreras çàãîðåëñÿ ïðèîáðåñòè íàøó, ò.ê. â ÓÎÒÀ èìååòñÿ òî÷íàÿ ñåðòèôèöèðîâàííàÿ ìåòðîëîãèÿ êîíöåíòðàöèè îçîíà â ãàçîâûõ è æèäêèõ ñðåäàõ è ìèêðîïðîöåññîðíûé êîíòðîëü ïðîöåññà. Ó ìåíÿ áûëè áîëüøèå ñîìíåíèÿ ïî ýòîìó êîíòðàêòó, ò.ê. èç-çà áîëüøèõ ðàññòîÿíèé óâåëè÷èâàþòñÿ ñëîæíîñòè (è ñòîèìîñòü) ïîñòàâêè îáîðóäîâàíèÿ äëÿ òåõíè÷åñêîãî îáñëóæèâàíèÿ èëè ðåìîíòà
  #1429  
Ñòàðûé 12.10.2003, 22:45
Artemij Okhotin Artemij Okhotin âíå ôîðóìà
Çàñëóæåííûé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.04.2003
Ãîðîä: Òàðóñà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 769
Artemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷!

Ññûëêè íà "ñåêðåòíûå" ìàòåðèàëû è íà âîïëè áîëüíûõ î òîì, ÷òî "åñëè áû íå..., ÿ áû äàâíî óìåð" ïðîñòî íåïðèëè÷íû.

Âàøà ññûëêà ïðî îçîíîòåðàïèþ ïðè ðàêå. Òàì âñåãî 16 áîëüíûõ è âûâîä î÷åíü ñêðîìíûé â ñîñëàãàòåëüíîì íàêëîíåíèè, ÷òî õàðàêòåðèçóåò àâòîðîâ ñ õîðîøåé ñòîðîíû: These findings support that ozone therapy could be a useful adjuvant in treatment of hypoxic tumors.

À ïðèâåäåííàÿ Âàìè çàìåòêà ñòðîèòñÿ ïî ñëåäóþùåìó ïðèíöèïó.
1. Âû äóìàåòå õèìèîòåðàïèÿ ýôôåêòèâíåå àëüòåðíàòèâíîé ìåäèöèíû? [Ïðè ýòîì íå óòî÷íÿåòñÿ î êàêîì çàáîëåâàíèè èäåò ðå÷ü, à çàìåòèò, ðàê -- ýòî íå îäíî çàáîëåâàíèå.]
2. Òàê, íåò, ñìîòðèòå, îíè ñàìè ïèøóò, ÷òî õèìèîòåðàïèÿ íåýôôåêòèâíà [ðå÷ü èäåò ðîâíî î stage one multiple myeloma].
3. Çíà÷èò, ðàç íå ýôôåêòèâíà õèìèîòåðàïèÿ, ýôôåêòèâíà àëüòåðíàòèâíàÿ ìåäèöèíà [áåç óêàçàíèÿ ìåòîäà è êîíêðåòíîãî çàáîëåâàíèÿ].

Ëîãèêà äëÿ êóõàðîê, íå ïîçîðüòåñü Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷.
Èç òîãî, ÷òî ðàê íà ñåãîäíÿøíèé äåíü ÷àñòî íåèçëå÷èì, â òîì ÷èñëå è ìåòîäàìè òðàäèöèîííîé ìåäèöèíû, âîâñå íå ñëåäóåò, ÷òî îí èçëå÷èì ìåòîäàìè àëüòåðíàòèâíîé ìåäèöèíû. Ýòî àðãóìåíò èç ñîâåòñêîãî àíåêäîòà: "-- Ïðàâäà â ÑÑÑÐ î÷åðåäè çà õëåáîì? -- À ó âàñ íåãðîâ áüþò...". Íå óíèæàéòå ñåáÿ äî òàêîãî.

Ïî ïîâîäó ñòàòüè î íåýôôåêòèâíîñòè õèìèîòåðàïèè. Î÷åíü èíòåðåñíàÿ çàêîíîìåðíîñòü: â ìåäèöèíñêîé ëèòåðàòóðå ÷àñòî âñòðå÷àþòñÿ ñòàòüè î íåýôôåêòèâíîñòè òîé èëè èíîé ìåòîäèêè, ïðåïàðàòà è ò.ä. (ðå÷ü êîíå÷íî, íå î ñîâåòñêîé ëèòåðàòóðå). Îòðèöàòåëüíûé ðåçóëüòàò -- òîæå ðåçóëüòàò, êàê ãîâîðèòñÿ.  îòëè÷èå îò ýòîãî ó àëüòåðíàòèâùèêîâ -- âñÿêîå ëûêî â ñòðîêó è ñîìíåíèÿ â ïðàâèëüíîñòè âûáðàííîãî ïóòè íàïðî÷ü îòñóòñòâóþò. Âïëîòü äî "ñåêðåòíûõ ïðîòîêîëîâ" è "ñâèäåòåëüñòâ èñöåëåíèé". Ïðè ýòîì âåñü PR èäåò íà ïóáëèêó, à íå íà ìåäèöèíñêîå ñîîáùåñòâî. Âû -- íå èñêëþ÷åíèå. ß óæå îáðàùàë âíèìàíèå íà Âàø ñàéò. Ëàäíî òàì, "êàíäèäîç ãåíèòàëèé", íî îçîí, îêàçûâàåòñÿ, ýôôåêòèâåí äàæå ïðè íàðóøåíèÿõ ñåðäå÷íîãî ðèòìà è èøåìè÷åñêîé áîëåçíè ñåðäöà. Ïðè ýòîì íè îäíîé ññûëêè, äàæå äëÿ îòìàçêè. Íó íå äåëàåòñÿ òàê, Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷. ß áû âîîáùå ñ÷èòàë, ÷òî ïîêà ïîä Âàøèì èìåíåì âèñèò òàêîå, íè îäèí ïðèëè÷íûé ÷åëîâåê ñ Âàìè ðàçãîâàðèâàòü íå äîëæåí, áóäü Âû õîòü òûñÿ÷ó ðàç êàíäèäàò íàóê è ëó÷øèé â ìèðå èçìåðèòåëü ñîäåðæàíèÿ îçîíà.

Ñíà÷àëà ìíå êàçàëîñü, ÷òî Âû èñðåííå ïûòàåòåñü ðàçîáðàòüñÿ â òîì, íà ÷òî îðèåíòèðóåòñÿ ïðèëè÷íîå ìåäèöèíñêîå ñîîáùåñòâî. Íî òåïåðü âèæó, ÷òî ýòî íå òàê. Äà, âèäèìî è íå òîëüêî ÿ ýòî âèæó, âîò è ïðîô. Ìåëüíè÷åíêî óæå íå ðåàãèðóåò íà Âàøè ïîñòû. Äà íó Âàñ â Ìåêñèêó, Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷, ÷åñòíîå ñëîâî, ðóêè áû Âàì íå ïîäàë.

--------------------------
ê ñîæàëåíèþ óæå áåç óâàæåíèÿ, À. Îõîòèí
  #1430  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 01:09
V. ZAITSEV V. ZAITSEV âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.07.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,330
V. ZAITSEV
Àðòåìèé, òî ÷òî Âû íå ïîäàäèòå ìíå ðóêó, ïîâåðòè, ïåðåæèâó. Ê ñîæàëåíèþ, ùàäèë Âàñ, êîãäà íåîäíîêðàòíî ñ ïàôîñîì «äàâàëè ïåòóõà» â ñâîèõ ñîîáùåíèÿõ, Âû æå òàêîé îáèä÷èâûé, êîãäà Âàñ çàäåâàþò. À ÷òî ïðèëè÷íî, Âû áû ê íåêîòîðûì ñâîèì âûñêàçûâàíèÿì ïðèñìîòðèòåñü.

Ïî ÈÁÑ è ãèïåðòîíèè «äëÿ îòìàçêè» ðàáîòû ïðèâîäèë è íè ðàç. À òî ÷òî Âû èõ íå âèäåëè - Âàøè òðóäíîñòè. Ìîãó ïðèâåñòè åù¸ òðîéêó.


ÂËÈßÍÈÅ ÎÇÎÍÎÒÅÐÀÏÈÈ ÍÀ ÝÍÄÎÒÅËÈÀËÜÍÓÞ ÄÈÑÔÓÍÊÖÈÞ Ó ÁÎËÜÍÛÕ ÈÁÑ, ÎÑËÎÆÍÅÍÍÎÉ ÕÐÎÍÈ×ÅÑÊÎÉ ÑÅÐÄÅ×ÍÎÉ ÍÅÄÎÑÒÀÒÎ×ÍÎÑÒÜÞ.
Å.À. ßêèìåíêî, Ñ.Í. Êîëîìèåö, À.Â. Àðòåìåíêî.
Îäåññêèé ãîñóäàðñòâåííûé ìåäèöèíñêèé óíèâåðñèòåò, ã. Îäåññà.
Öåëüþ èññëåäîâàíèÿ ÿâèëàñü îöåíêà âëèÿíèÿ îçîíîòåðàïèè íà ñîñòîÿíèå ýíäîòåëèàëüíîé ôóíêöèè ó áîëüíûõ èøåìè÷åñêîé áîëåçíüþ ñåðäöà, îñëîæíåííîé ñåðäå÷íîé íåäîñòàòî÷íîñòüþ.
Íàìè áûëî îáñëåäîâàíî 45 ìóæ÷èí, áîëüíûõ ÈÁÑ, ñ ïðîÿâëåíèÿìè ÑÍ II-III ôóíêöèîíàëüíîãî êëàññîâ (ÔÊ) ïî êëàññèôèêàöèè Íüþ-Éîðêñêîé àññîöèàöèè êàðäèîëîãîâ (NYHA).  èññëåäîâàíèå íå âêëþ÷àëè ïàöèåíòîâ, ïåðåíåñøèõ èíôàðêò ìèîêàðäà â òå÷åíèå ïðåäûäóùèõ 6 ìåñÿöåâ, èìåþùèõ íåñòàáèëüíîå òå÷åíèå ÈÁÑ, íåêîððåãèðîâàííóþ ÀÃ, ñàõàðíûé äèàáåò è ðåâìàòè÷åñêèå ïîðîêè ñåðäöà.  çàâèñèìîñòè îò ïðîâîäèìîé òåðàïèè ïàöèåíòû áûëè ðàçäåëåíû íà 2 ãðóïïû.  îñíîâíîé ãðóïïå (n=23) ïîìèìî òðàäèöèîííîãî ìåäèêàìåíòîçíîãî ëå÷åíèÿ ÈÁÑ è ÑÍ (äèãîêñèí 0,25 ìã/ñóò, ýíàëàïðèë 5-10ìã/ñóò, ìåòîïðîëîë 25 – 100 ìã/ñóò, ôóðîñåìèä 40-80 ìã/ñóò. ( ïî ìåðå íåîáõîäèìîñòè) äîïîëíèòåëüíî ïðîâîäèëè ïðîöåäóðû îçîíîòåðàïèè â ôîðìå âíóòðèâåííîãî ââåäåíèÿ îçîíèðîâàííîãî ôèçèîëîãè÷åñêîãî ðàñòâîðà (ÎÔÐ) îáüåìîì 200 ìë (êîíöåíòðàöèÿ îçîíà 2000 ìêã/ìë) êóðñîì 8 - 10 ïðîöåäóð ÷åðåç äåíü. Îáå ãðóïïû áûëè ñîïîñòàâèìû ïî âîçðàñòó, ìàññå òåëà, ÔÊ ñòåíîêàðäèè è ÑÍ, äëèòåëüíîñòè ÈÁÑ è ÑÍ.
Áîëüíûì ïðîâîäèëîñü îáùåêëèíè÷åñêîå îáñëåäîâàíèå, ÝÊà è ýõîêàðäèîãðàôèÿ (ÝõîÊÃ) íà óëüòðàçâóêîâîì àïïàðàòå «Dornier AI4800». Âûðàæåííîñòü ýíäîòåëèéçàâèñèìîé âàçîäèëàòàöèè (ÝÇÂÄ) îöåíèâàëè ïî óâåëè÷åíèþ äèàìåòðà ïëå÷åâîé àðòåðèè ïðè ïðîâåäåíèè ñ ðåàêòèâíîé ãèïåðåìèåé [Èâàíîâà è ñî-àâò.,1997]. Ýíäîòåëèîöèòåìèþ îïðåäåëÿëè ïî ÷èñëó öèðêóëèðóþùèõ â êðîâè äåñêâàìèðîâàííûõ ýíäîòåëèàëüíûõ êëåòîê (ÖÝÊ) [Hladovec et all.,1978]. Îáñëåäîâàíèå ïàöèåíòîâ ïðîâîäèëè â äèíàìèêå äî, è ïîñëå ëå÷åíèÿ.
Àíàëèç ðåçóëüòàòîâ ëå÷åíèÿ áîëüíûõ ÑÍ II-III ÔÊ îçîíîì â ìàëûõ êîíöåíòðàöèÿõ ïðîäåìîíñòðèðîâàë õîðîøóþ ñóáúåêòèâíóþ ïåðåíîñèìîñòü òåðàïèè, óëó÷øåíèå îáùåãî ñàìî÷óâñòâèÿ ïàöèåíòîâ. Îòìå÷åíî äîñòîâåðíîå ñíèæåíèå ôóíêöèîíàëüíîãî êëàññà ÑÍ (ñ 2,3 äî 1,6 â îñíîâíîé ãðóïïå è ñ 2,2 äî 1,7 â ãðóïïå ñðàâíåíèÿ) è ñòåíîêàðäèè (ñ 2,1 äî 1,6 è ñ 1,9 äî 1,5 ñîîòâåòñòâåííî). Ôðàêöèÿ âûáðîñà óâåëè÷èëàñü ê ìîìåíòó âûïèñêè â îñíîâíîé ãðóïïå íà 6,3%, à ñðåäè áîëüíûõ, ïîëó÷àâøèõ òîëüêî ìåäèêàìåíòîçíóþ òåðàïèþ íà 4,3% (p>0,05).
Íåîáõîäèìî îòìåòèòü, ÷òî ïî ðÿäó ïàðàìåòðîâ íàìè îòìå÷åíû äîñòîâåðíûå îòëè÷èÿ ìåæäó èññëåäóåìûìè ãðóïïàìè, ñâèäåòåëüñòâóþùèìè î ïîëîæèòåëüíîì âëèÿíèè îçîíîòåðàïèè íà ïîêàçàòåëè, îòðàæàþùèå ôóíêöèþ ýíäîòåëèÿ ñîñóäèñòîé ñòåíêè (òàáë.1).

Òàáëèöà 1. Ïîêàçàòåëè ýíäîòåëèàëüíîé ôóíêöèè ó îáñëåäóåìûõ áîëüíûõ äî è ïîñëå ëå÷åíèÿ (M±m).

Ïîêàçàòåëü Îñíîâíàÿ ãðóïïà Ãðóïïà ñðàâíåíèÿ
(n=24) (n=21)
Äî ëå÷åíèÿ Ïîñëå ëå÷åíèÿ Äî ëå÷åíèÿ Ïîñëå ëå÷åíèÿ

Êîëè÷åñòâî öèðêóëè- 15,2±2,3 9,7 ± 2,7* 13,6±3,1 9,0 ± 3,2*
ðóþùèõ ýíäîòåëèî-
öèòîâ (ÖÝÊ) (êë/ìêë)
Îòíîñèòåëüíîå ðàñ- 6,5±3,2 11,9 ± 1,6 * # 5,8±2,7 8,1 ± 2,3*
øèðåíèå ïëå÷åâîé
àðòåðèè (ÝÇÂÄ), (%)

Ïðèìå÷àíèå: * - ðàçëè÷èÿ äîñòîâåðíû ïî ñðàâíåíèþ ñ èñõîäíûìè çíà÷åíèÿìè ïðè
p< 0,05; # - äîñòîâåðíîñòü ðàçëè÷èé ìåæäó îñíîâíîé è êîíòðîëüíîé ãðóïïàìè ïàöèåíòîâ ïðè p< 0,05.
Óñòàíîâëåíî, ÷òî ïðèìåíåíèå îçîíà â ñî÷åòàíèè ñ ìåäèêàìåíòîçíîé òåðàïèåé îêàçûâàåò íå òîëüêî áëàãîïðèÿòíîå âëèÿíèå íà êëèíè÷åñêîå òå÷åíèå ÑÍ, íî è ñîïðîâîæäàåòñÿ áîëåå âûðàæåííîé ïîëîæèòåëüíîé äèíàìèêîé ïîêàçàòåëåé, îòðàæàþùèõ ýíäîòåëèàëüíóþ ôóíêöèþ (çà ñ÷åò ñóùåñòâåííîãî ðîñòà ïîêàçàòåëÿ ÝÇÂÄ ïëå÷åâîé àðòåðèè). Ìåõàíèçì ïîëîæèòåëüíîãî äåéñòâèÿ îçîíîòåðàïèè íà ôóíêöèþ ïîâðåæäåííûõ ýíäîòåëèàëüíûõ êëåòîê, ïîâèäèìîìó, ñâÿçàí ñ àêòèâàöèåé ôåðìåíòà å-NO-ñèíòåòàçû, â ðåçóëüòàòå ÷åãî îáðàçóåòñÿ îêèñü àçîòà, îáëàäàþùàÿ ñîñóäîðàñøèðÿþùèì äåéñòâèåì [Ãóñòîâ ñ ñîàâò.,1999].
Òàêèì îáðàçîì, ïðèìåíåíèå îçîíîòåðàïèè â ôîðìå âíóòðèâåííîãî êàïåëüíîãî ââåäåíèÿ ÎÔÐ â íèçêèõ êîíöåíòðàöèÿõ óëó÷øàåò îáùåêëèíè÷åñêîå ñîñòîÿíèå ïàöèåíòîâ, äîñòîâåðíî ñíèæàåò ôóíêöèîíàëüíûé êëàññ ñòåíîêàðäèè è ñåðäå÷íîé íåäîñòàòî÷íîñòè, è ìîæåò áûòü ñ óñïåõîì èñïîëüçîâàíî â êîìïëåêñíîì ëå÷åíèè ÑÍ ó áîëüíûõ, ñòðàäàþùèõ èøåìè÷åñêîé áîëåçíüþ ñåðäöà.




ÝÔÔÅÊÒÈÂÍÎÑÒÜ ÎÇÎÍÎÒÅÐÀÏÈÈ ÏÐÈ ËÅ×ÅÍÈÈ ÏÀÖÈÅÍÒÎÂ Ñ ÀÒÅÐÎÑÊËÅÐÎÇÎÌ ÊÎÐÎÍÀÐÍÛÕ È ÖÅÐÅÁÐÀËÜÍÛÕ ÑÎÑÓÄÎÂ.
Í.È. Æóëèíà, Ê.Í. Êîíòîðùèêîâà, Í.Â. Ìîðîçîâà.
Ìåäèöèíñêèé èíñòèòóò, Í. Íîâãîðîä, Ðîññèÿ.
Èññëåäîâàíî âëèÿíèå ïðèìåíåíÿ îçîíèðîâàííîãî èçîòîíè÷åñêîãî ðàñòâîðà õëîðèäà íàòðèÿ ïðè ëå÷åíèè èøåìè÷åñêèõ áîëüíûõ ñ êëèíè÷åñêîé ñòåíîêàðäèåé- ²², ²²² ñòåïåíè è öåðåáðîâàñêóëÿðíîé íåäîñòàòî÷íîñòüþ, ñâÿçàííîé ñ àòåðîñêëåðîçîì.
 êîíöå êóðñà ëå÷åíèÿ ÷àñòîòà ïðèñòóïîâ ñòåíîêàðäèè ñíèçèëàñü â äâà ñ ïîëîâèíîé ðàçà ïðè ñíèæåíèè äîçèðîâêè íèòðîãëèöåðèíà è óâåëè÷åíèè âûíîñëèâîñòè ê ôèçè÷åñêèì íàãðóçêàì. Ó íåêîòîðûõ ïàöèåíòîâ íàáëþäàëàñü ïîëîæèòåëüíàÿ äèíàìèêà â ÝÊÃ, òî åñòü íîðìàëèçàöèÿ ïðîöåññîâ ðåïîëÿðèçàöèè. Îðãàíè÷åñêèå íåâðîëîãè÷åñêèå ñèìïòîìû íå èçìåíèëèñü. Ïîëîæèòåëüíî èçìåíèëèñü ñèìïòîìû âåãåòàòèâíîé äèñôóíêöèè. Äàííûå ÐÝà ïîêàçàëè ïîëîæèòåëüíóþ äèíàìèêó, ñíèæåíèå ðåàêòèâíîñòè ñòåíîê ñîñóäîâ, ÝÝà ïîêàçàëà àêòèâàöèþ àëüôà-ðèòìà.  ïñèõîëîãè÷åñêîì îòíîøåíèè óìåíüøèëèñü ýìîöèîíàëüíàÿ íàïðÿæåííîñòü è ïðîÿâëåíèÿ òðåâîæíîñòè ïðè óëó÷øåíèè îáùåãî ñîñòîÿíèÿ. Íå áûëî îòìå÷åíî íèêàêèõ îñëîæíåíèé èëè îòðèöàòåëüíûõ ðåàêöèé íà îçîíîòåðàïèþ.
Áèîõèìè÷åñêèå àíàëèçû ïîêàçàëè èíòåíñèôèêàöèþ àíòèîêñèäàíòíîé çàùèòíîé ñèñòåìû, ñíèæåíèå óðîâíÿ ìîëåêëÿðíûõ ïðîäóêòîâ ïåðåêèñíîãî îêèñëåíèÿ ëèïèäîâ, êîíúþãèðîâàííûõ äèåíîâ è îñíîâàíèé Øèôôà, íîðìàëèçàöèþ ñëåäóþùèõ ïîêàçàòåëåé ëèïäíîãî îáìåíà: õîëåñòåðîëà è òðèãëèöåðèäîâ. Èòàê, ïðèìåíåíèå îçîíîòåðàïèè ïðè õðîíè÷åñêîé íåäîñòàòî÷íîñòè êîðîíàðíûõ è öåðåáðàëüíûõ ñîñóäîâ ÿâëÿåòñÿ íîâûì íàïðàâëåíèåì â ïðîôèëàêòèêå è ðåàáèëèòàöèè äàííîé êàòåãîðèè ïàöèåíòîâ.


ÎÇÎÍÎÒÅÐÀÏÈß ÏÐÈ ÈØÅÌÈ×ÅÑÊÎÉ ÖÅÐÅÁÐÎÂÀÑÊÓËßÐÍÎÉ ÁÎËÅÇÍÈ
E. Devesa, S. Menendez, Ì. M. Rodriguez, M. Gomez, J. Garcia, A. Carballo,Wilfredo Diaz Ãîñïèòàëü "Äîêòîð Ñàëüâàäîð Àëüåíäå", Íàöèîíàëüíûé öåíòð íàó÷íûõ èññëåäîâàíèé.Ãàâàííà, Êóáà
Öåðåáðîâàñêóëÿðíàÿ áîëåçíü ÿâëÿåòñÿ àêòóàëüíîé ïðîáëåìîé, âñëåäñòâèå âûñîêîãî óðîâíÿ ïîñëåäñòâèé ó âûæèâøèõ, êîòîðûå îãðàíè÷èâàþò èõ ôèçè÷åñêèå, ñîöèàëüíûå è ñåìåéíûå âîçìîæíîñòè.
Öåëüþ íàñòîÿùåé ðàáîòû ÿâëÿåòñÿ îöåíêà ýôôåêòèâíîñòè îçîíîòåðàïèè ïðè öåðåáðîâàñêóëÿðíîé áîëåçíè èøåìè÷åñêîãî òèïà â îñòðîé, õðîíè÷åñêîé è çàïóùåííîé ôîðìàõ. Îöåíêà ïðîâîäèëàñü íà 120 ïàöèåíòàõ. Ñîñòîÿíèå ïàöèåíòîâ îöåíèâàëîñü ñ ïîìîùüþ êëèíè÷åñêîãî îáñëåäîâàíèÿ è òåñòèðîâàíèÿ ñ ïîìîùüþ ìåòîäà ìíîãîàñïåêòíîé îöåíêè ïåðåä ëå÷åíèåì è â êîíöå åãî. Êëèíè÷åñêîå ñîñòîÿíèå óëó÷øèëîñü ó 88% îò îáùåãî ÷èñëà ïàöèåíòîâ, íàèëó÷øèå ðåçóëüòàòû áûëè ó ïàöèåíòîâ â îñòðîé ôàçå áîëåçíè. Ìåòîä ìíîãîàñïåêòíîé îöåíêè ïîêàçàë óëó÷øåíèå âñåõ èçìåðÿåìûõ ïàðàìåòðîâ, îñîáåííî â ïîâñåäíåâíîé äåÿòåëüíîñòè.

Ïî ïîâîäó ðàêà ïðèâåë îäíó èç ðàáîò òîëüêî äëÿ ïðèìåðà, ÷èòàéòå âíèìàòåëüíåé.

È íà âñÿêèé ñëó÷àé, íà áóäóùåå, Àðòåìèé, ñîîáùàþ: Âàøå ìíåíèå îá ÎÒ ìåíÿ, êàê è àâòîðîâ (àêàä., ñåìü ïðîôåññîðîâ è äð.) ïîñîáèÿ äëÿ âðà÷åé, çà ñîêðàùåííûé âàðèàíò êîòîðîãî, ñî ìíîé «íè îäèí ïðèëè÷íûé ÷åëîâåê ðàçãîâàðèâàòü íå äîëæåí» – ÍÅ ÂÎËÍÓÅÒ.
  #1431  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 04:11
Àâàòàð äëÿ yananshs
yananshs yananshs âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.02.2003
Ãîðîä: NY
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9,664
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 15
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 56 ðàç(à) çà 51 ñîîáùåíèé
yananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷, äîðîãîé, ïîêà áîëüøèíñòâî Âàøèõ îïïîíåíòîâ ñïèò, óáåðèòå Âû ðàäè áîãà ýòè òðè àáñòðàêòà. Ïðîñòî äîáðûé Âàì ñîâåò. Ïðÿìî ïëàêàòü õî÷åòñÿ îò æàëîñòè ê èõ àâòîðàì. Âû óâåðåíû, ÷òî ýòè àâòîðû îáðàäóþòñÿ, åñëè óçíàþò, ÷òî èõ ðàáîòû âûíåñåíû íà âñåîáùåå îáñóæäåíèå. Ñoìíåâàþñü ÿ ÷òî-òî.

ßíà Ñòóäåíöîâà
  #1432  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 11:52
V. ZAITSEV V. ZAITSEV âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.07.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,330
V. ZAITSEV
ßíà!
ß ïîìåùàë íà ôîðóìå ïî ýòèì ïàòîëîãèÿì è äð. ðàáîòû, â êîòîðûõ äàæå áûëè âîëøåáíûå ñëîâà òèïà äâîéíûå ñëåïûå. À ýòè àáñòðàêòû, êîòîðûå áûëè ïîä ðóêîé, ïðèâåë íå äëÿ îáñóæäåíèÿ, à äëÿ, êàê âûðàçèëñÿ Àðòåìèé, «îòìàçêè», ÷òîáû ïîêàçàòü ãåîãðàôèþ. À òî, ïî åãî ñëîâàì, íåïîíÿòíî îòêóäà âîîáùå âñÿêèå èøåìèè âûïîëçëè.
Ïî ìîèì äàííûì â ðÿäå ËÓ, íàïðèìåð, â 600 - êîå÷íîé êëèíèêå ÌÌÀ, ñåé÷àñ íàáðàíû äîâîëüíî îáøèðíûå ìíîãîëåòíèå äàííûå ïî ÎÒ ïðè ñåðäå÷íî –ñîñóäèñòûõ. Áóäåò ó ìåíÿ âîçìîæíîñòü è ïî ðàçðåøåíèþ àâòîðîâ ïîïûòàþñü èõ ñîîáùèòü. Åñëè, êîíå÷íî, ÿ åù¸ áóäó, ê ýòîìó âðåìåíè, â ýòîì ôîðóìå ó÷àñòâîâàòü. À òî ìåòîäû ãðóïïû òîâàðèùåé ïî àãðåññèâíîìó âûæèãàíèþ âñÿêîãî èíàêîìûñëèÿ ñ ôîðóìà, óæå îòâàäèëè íåìàëî âðà÷åé (ïðîôåññîðîâ), âïîëíå
«òðàäèöèîííèêîâ», îò æåëàíèÿ ó÷àñòâîâàòü â äèñêóññèÿõ.
  #1433  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 14:38
Àâàòàð äëÿ yananshs
yananshs yananshs âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.02.2003
Ãîðîä: NY
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9,664
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 15
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 56 ðàç(à) çà 51 ñîîáùåíèé
yananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Òî åñòü Âû ïðåêðàñíî ïîíèìàëè, ÷òî ýòè àáñòðàêòû, "êîòîðûå áûëè ïîä ðóêîé" óáîãè. Çà÷åì æå ïóáëèêîâàëè? Çà÷åì ïóáëèêîâàëè îñòàëüíûå íå ìåíåå óáîãèå ðàáîòû? Íè÷åãî êðîìå íåäîóìåíèÿ è ðàçäðàæåíèÿ îíè âûçâàòü íå ìîãëè. "Àãðåññèÿ", î êîòîðîé Âû ãîâîðèòå - íîðìàëüíàÿ ðåàêöèÿ íîðìàëüíûõ ëþäåé êîãäà èõ âíîâü è âíîâü ïðèçûâàþò ÷èòàòü ïñåâäîíàó÷íûå, ïñåâäîìåäèöèíñêèå ñòàòüè. Èçâèíèòå.

ßíà Ñòóäåíöîâà
  #1434  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 17:29
Àâàòàð äëÿ yananshs
yananshs yananshs âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.02.2003
Ãîðîä: NY
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9,664
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 15
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 56 ðàç(à) çà 51 ñîîáùåíèé
yananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåyananshs ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
P.S. ×òî êàñàåòñÿ ìåêñèêàíñêèõ æóëèêîâ, òî ñ èõ æåðòâàìè ïðèõîäèòñÿ íåðåäêî âñòðå÷àòüñÿ. Ïàðó ìåñÿöåâ íàçàä áîëüíîé ïðîõîäèë ó íàñ ñêàíèðîâàíèå ñêåëåòà è ProstaScint. Ãîä íàçàä - ïðîñòàòýêòîìèÿ ïî ïîâîäó ðàêà.  òå÷åíèå ãîäà áîëüíîé íåîäíîêðàòíî îáðàùàëñÿ â ìåêñèêàíñêèå àëüòåðíàòèâíûå êëèíèêè, ãäå åãî ïîäîãðåâàëè (ãèïåðòåðìèÿ, êàæåòñÿ íàçûâàåòñÿ), îáëó÷àëè åãî êðîâü ðàçëè÷íûìè ñïåêòðàìè, îçîíèðîâàëè è ò.ä è ò.ï.. Âñå ñâîè ñáåðåæåíèÿ îí îòäàë ìåêñèêàíñêèì æóëèêàì òîëüêî äëÿ òîãî, ÷òîáû òåïåðü îáà ýòè èññëåäîâàíèÿ âûãëÿäåëè óæàñíî: ìíîæåñòâåííûå ìåòàñòàçû â êîñòÿõ è ëèìôàòè÷åñêèõ óçëàõ. ß íå óòâåðæäàþ, ÷òî áûñòðîå ïðîãðåññèðîâàíèå åãî áîëåçíè âûçâàëè âñå ýòè ìàíèïóëÿöèè (õîòÿ íåëüçÿ áûòü ïîëíîñòüþ óâåðåííûì, ÷òî íåò), íî ÷òî ïîëüçû íèêàêîé âñå ýòè ïðîöåäóðû íå ïðèíåñëè - ýòî òî÷íî.

Äîâîëüíî ÷àñòî ïðèõîäèòñÿ äåëàòü ñêàíèðîâàíèå ìîçãà ( Tc99m HMPAO brain SPECT) ïàöèåíòàì ñ èøåìè÷åñêèìè íàðóøåíèÿìè, ïîëó÷èâøèì ëå÷åíèå ó àëüòåðíàòèâíûõ öåëèòåëåé. Íè ðàçó íå âèäåëà íèêàêîé ïîëîæèòåëüíîé äèíàìèêè. Ýòî òàê, ëè÷íûå íàáëþäåíèÿ.
  #1435  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 19:20
V.Dvorianchikov V.Dvorianchikov âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 01.08.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 2,953
V.Dvorianchikov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïëîõóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Ãðûçíÿ ñàääóêåÿ ñ ôàðèñååì.
×åì íà äðóãèõ êèâàòü è çàêàçóõîé ïåðåïë¸âûâàòüñÿ, âîçüìèòå è îïóáëèêóéòå çäåñü êàæäûé ñâîè ïåðñîíàëüíûå óñïåõè, ÷òîáû âñå æåëàþùèå ìîãëè èõ ñîïîñòàâèòü.
  #1436  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 20:10
V. ZAITSEV V. ZAITSEV âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.07.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,330
V. ZAITSEV
ßíà!
Ðàáîòû, â êîòîðûõ, ïî Âàøåìó ìíåíèþ, äèçàéí íå òîò, ãðóïïû ñðàâíåíèÿ íåêîððåêòíî ïîäîáðàíû – óáîãè. Íî çàòî óòâåðæäåíèÿ, â êîòîðûõ îòñóòñòâóåò äàæå ìèíèìàëüíàÿ êîíêðåòíàÿ èíôîðìàöèÿ, êîãî, ïî÷åìó è êàê, òèïà: «äîâîëüíî ÷àñòî ïðèõîäèòñÿ äåëàòü ñêàíèðîâàíèå ìîçãà (Tc99m HMPAO brain SPECT) ïàöèåíòàì ñ èøåìè÷åñêèìè íàðóøåíèÿìè, ïîëó÷èâøèì ëå÷åíèå ó àëüòåðíàòèâíûõ öåëèòåëåé. Íè ðàçó íå âèäåëà íèêàêîé ïîëîæèòåëüíîé äèíàìèêè» - ñàìîå òî? «Àëüòåðíàòèâíûå öåëèòåëè», êàê Âû èõ íàçûâàåòå, ïðèâîäÿò õîòÿ áû êîíêðåòíûõ áîëüíûõ, àíàëèçû, òåñòû, ñíèìêè äî è ïîñëå ëå÷åíèÿ. Âû æå íå ïðèâîäèòå íè÷åãî, íî çàòî «ïðàâèëüíûé ìåäèê», íà äóõ íå ïåðåíîñÿùèé íè÷åãî àëüòåðíàòèâíîãî, ïîýòîìó âåðèòü íàäî Âàì.
  #1437  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 20:27
Ãîñòü (69.27.229.11)
Ãîñòü
 
Ñîîáùåíèé: n/a
Äà ÿ è íå ïðåòåíäóþ. ß æå ñêàçàëà, âñåãî ëèøü ëè÷íûå íàáëþäåíèÿ. Íå âåðèòü èì èìååòå ïîëíîå ïðàâî. À âîò íàó÷íàÿ ðàáîòà äîëæíà âûãëÿäåòü òàê, ÷òîáû âåðèòü åé õîòåëîñü, è ÷òîáû ó äðóãèõ ó÷åíûõ âîçíèêëî æåëàíèå ýòó ðàáîòó âîñïðîèçâåñòè. Ó ÷åëîâåêà, ïðî÷èòàâøåãî âûøåïðèâåäåíûå àáñòðàêòû, íå ïîÿâèòñÿ äàæå æåëàíèå îçíàêîìèòñÿ ñî ñòàòüÿìè ïîëíîñòüþ. Âïðî÷åì, ýòî ñêàçêà ïðî áåëîãî áû÷êà. Âñåãî äîáðîãî.

ßíà Ñòóäåíöîâà
  #1438  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 20:47
Artemij Okhotin Artemij Okhotin âíå ôîðóìà
Çàñëóæåííûé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.04.2003
Ãîðîä: Òàðóñà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 769
Artemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåArtemij Okhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
 íàóêå äåéñòâóåò "ïðåçóìïöèÿ âèíîâíîñòè": âñÿêàÿ íîâàÿ ãèïîòåçà ñ÷èòàåòñÿ íåâåðíîé, ïîêà îíà íå ïîäòâåðæäåíà óáåäèòåëüíûìè äàííûìè. À Â.ß. õî÷åò, ÷òîáû âñÿêóþ íîâóþ èäåþ ñ÷èòàëè áû âåðíîé è ïûòàëèñü åå âñåðüåç îïðîâåðãàòü.
Íî ëèøíèå èäåè è ïîíÿòèÿ ñðåçàþò áðèòâîé Îêêàìà. Ìîæåò áûòü äåëî â òîì, ÷òî âî âðåìåíà Â.ß. â êàíäèäàòñêèé ìèíèìóì âõîäèëà ìàðêñèñòêî-ëåíèíñêàÿ ôèëîñîôèÿ, à óìíûõ äÿäåé òèïà Þìà, Ïîïïåðà, Ëàêàòîñà è äð. ñ÷èòàëè áóðæóàçíîé äðÿíüþ?
  #1439  
Ñòàðûé 13.10.2003, 22:05
Zhivov Zhivov âíå ôîðóìà
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 20.08.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,792
Zhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåZhivov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷,
Òî ÷òî âàø ïîäåëüíèê èç Ìåêñèêè îòïåòûé æóëèê âèäíî êàê ðàç èç ñàéòå ýòîãî îàçèñà ìåêñèêàíñêîãî øàðëàòàíñòâà. Âû õîòÿ áû ïðîéäèòåñü ïî ìåòîäàì ëå÷åíèÿ. ×òî êàñàåòñÿ íåêîòîðûõ ôàêòîâ, òî â Ïèòòñáóðãå êëèíèêó êàíòðåðàñîâ ðåêëàìèðîâàë â ñâîèõ ïåðäà÷àõ ïî òåëåâèäåíèþ äðóãîé îòïåòûé øàðëàòàí ìåñòíîãî ðàçëèâà. ïðèâîæó öèòàòû èç ïèñüìà îäíîãî èç æóðíàëèñòîâ ïî ýòîìó ïîâîäó:

Here is a prior letter that I sent concerning Dr. Gallagher's support
for Tijuana cancer clinics. Was reporter Ellen Mazo totally unaware of this material? Was Editor Linn? Do they care?

Subject: Letter to the Editor Re: Alt-Med Cancer Treatments
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 12:08:28 -0700
To: Editor John G.Craig, Jr.
34 Blvd of the Allies
Pittsburgh, PA 15222

Editor Craig:

Thanks to the Post-Gazette for the front page story of Patti Davis'sterrible experience with alternative cancer therapy at a clinic in Tijuana, Mexico (P-G 4/9/99). Given the popularity of such unproven treatments, her tragic story is but one of hundreds of similar cases going totally unreported in the nation's alt-med-entranced media.

It is ironic that just two weeks earlier the Post-Gazette Your Health section ran an advertisement for a lecture by Dr. Francisco Contreras, the Chief-of-Staff of a similar alternative medicine cancer clinic in Tijuana. The clinic is cynically called "The Oasis of Hope Hospital".
As I explained in a prior letter to the Post-Gazette's Health Editor,
Francisco Contreras is the son of Dr. Ernesto Contreras, one of the perpetrators of the Laetrile (apricot pit oil) cancer cure hoax of the 1960s and 1970s. As a result of meeting Dr. Contreras, other desperate Pittsburghers no doubt have just this past week been enticed to pursue "hope" in Tijuana.

Contreras was invited to Pittsburgh by Chiropractor Martin Gallagher to speak March 27 at a seminar given by Three Rivers Health and Nutrition. Gallagher, a constant presence on regional radio and TV, has, in my opinion, built his career on undermining public confidence in mainstream medicine. He even markets his own book on what he calls "21st Century" medicine.
The Federal Trade Commission has recently begun cracking down on false and misleading health advertising. Perhaps it is time for the Post-Gazette to begin monitoring its own advertising policies for the sake of the public's health. The media should be doing its utmost to expose dangerous quackery, instead of promoting it for a few extra advertising dollars.

Thank You,
E. Patrick Curry

Ýòà öèòàòà âçÿòà [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

À íà [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ] ìîæíî íàéòè ìàññó èíòåðåñíîé èíôîðìàöèè î øàðëàòàíñòâå â îíêîëîãèè, â òîì ÷èñëå è î ïîäåëüíèêàõ Âëàäèìèðà ßêîâëåâè÷à èç Òèõóàíû. Âîò ýòè ñòðîêèOasis of Hope - Contreras quack clinic in Mexico- this is in Tijuana, not California Î÷åíü õîðîøî ãîâîðÿò î ðåïóòàöèè øàðëàòàíîâ Êàíòðåðàñîâ â ÑØÀ è îáüÿñíÿþò ïî÷åìó Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷ ïðèíÿë ñâîèõ ïîäåëüíèêîâ çà àìåðèêàíöåâ (è íàì ïûòàëñÿ âòþõàòü, ïîêà Åâãåíèé Ñòóäåíöîâ åãî íå îñòàíîâèë).  ñâîåé ðåêëàìå îíè âèäèìî óòâåðæäàëè, ÷òî èõ êëèíèêà áàçèðóåòñÿ â Êàëèôîðíèè. Íà ýòîé æå ñòðàíèöå ìîæíî íàéòè è ìíåíèå î ëåòðèëå, êîòîðûé ïðîñòî èìåíóþò îòêðîâåííûì øàðëàòàíñòâîì. À âåäü Êàíòðåðàñû äî ñèõ ïîð áàëóþòñÿ ýòèì "ìåäèêàìåíòîì". Áîëåå ïîäðîáíî î ëåòðèëå è Êàíòðåðàñå ñòàðøåì ìîæíî íàéòè
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]

Òàê ÷òî Âëàäèìèð ßêîâëåâè÷, åñëè ñîâåñòü ïîçâîëÿåò, òî íàëàæèâàéòå (îò ñëîâî ëàæà) ìèêðîïðîöåññîðíûé êîíòðîëü ïðîöåññà ó Âàøèõ fellow swindlers èç Ìåêñèêè. Îíè îöåíÿò íåîñïîðèìûå ïðåèìóùåñòâà è íàèâûñøèé òåõíîëîãè÷åñêèé óðîâåíü "ÓÎÒà", òî áèøü âàøåé ìàøèíêè. À ðàññòîÿíèå äëÿ íàñòîÿùèõ äðóçåé íå ïîìåõà! Êàê âñåãäà ñ îçîí-ïðèâåòîì!
  #1440  
Ñòàðûé 14.10.2003, 03:13
V. ZAITSEV V. ZAITSEV âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
çàáàíåí
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 25.07.2001
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,330
V. ZAITSEV
Àëåêñåé Âèêòîðîâè÷!
Ìû îáùàåìñÿ, êàê áóäòî, â äâóõ íåïåðåñåêàþùèõñÿ ïëîñêîñòÿõ.
Âû ñïðàøèâàåòå, íàïðèìåð: «À Âû (êòî-ëèáî) íå ïðîáîâàëè ñðàâíèâàòü (äà åùå â íåçàâèñèìîé ëàáîðàòîðèè) ÷òî ïðîèñõîäèò ñ ïîêàçàòåëÿìè èììóíèòåòà, åñëè îäíîé ãðóïïå ââîäèòü îçîíèðîâàííûé ðàñòâîð, à äðóãîé ñ ïîìîùüþ òîãî æå ïðèáîð÷èêà â àáñîëþòíî òåõ æå óñëîâèÿõ íåîçîíèðîâàííûé?»
ß îòâå÷àþ: «Äà, Àëåêñåé Âèêòîðîâè÷, ïðîáîâàëè è ìíîãî ðàç è íà ñîáà÷êàõ (êðûñêàõ) è íà áîëüíûõ». È çà ýòè ñëîâà ïîâåðòè, îòâå÷àþ. Âàì îòâåò íå íðàâèòüñÿ è Âû åãî èãíîðèðóåòå.

Ñïðàøèâàþ ÿ: «Êàê ìîæåò òðèäöàòü ëåò ñóùåñòâîâàòü, ðàçâèâàòüñÿ è ðàñøèðÿòüñÿ ËÓ, åñëè âñå âðà÷è êëèíèêè æóëèêè, à ìåòîäèêè øàðëàòàíñêèå?  êëèíèêå çà ýòè ãîäû òîëüêî ðàêîâûõ áîëüíûõ ïðîëå÷åíî áîëåå 100000 ÷åëîâåê, ïðè÷åì ñ êàæäûì ãîäîì êîëè÷åñòâî ïàöèåíòîâ óâåëè÷èâàåòñÿ. ×òî ÑØÀ ñòðàíà èäèîòîâ, êîòîðûå íåñìîòðÿ íà âñå îòðèöàòåëüíûå çà òðèäöàòü ëåò ñóùåñòâîâàíèÿ êëèíèêè ðåçóëüòàòû âñå åäóò è åäóò òóäà ëå÷èòüñÿ?»
Òåïåðü íå íðàâèòüñÿ è èãíîðèðóåòñÿ âîïðîñ. À âìåñòî îòâåòà î÷åðåäíîé ìîíîëîã. È òàê ïðàêòè÷åñêè âñåãäà, âî âñåõ íàøèõ äèñêóññèÿõ. Ñëûøèòå òîëüêî ñåáÿ.

ß íå çíàþ, íàñêîëüêî â The Oasis of Hope Hospital ëå÷åíèå äåéñòâèòåëüíî ýôôåêòèâíî. Íî çàäàþñü âîïðîñîì: ÷èñòîå øàðëàòàíñòâî, è òðèäöàòü ëåò, 100000 ðàêîâûõ áîëüíûõ è êëèíèêà îòêðûâàåò íîâûé êîðïóñ? È ê ÷åìó, çà÷åì âèçèòû â êëèíèêó îíêîëîãîâ èç äðóãèõ ñòðàí? Ðàçîáëà÷àòü æóëèêîâ?

Ïî÷åìó ÿ äîëæåí îäíîçíà÷íî íå äîâåðÿòü ìíîãîëåòíèì êëèíè÷åñêèì èññëåäîâàíèÿì [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
À òîðæåñòâóþùå, âñëåä çà Âàìè, äåëàòü âûâîäû èñõîäÿ èç ÿâíî çàêàçíîé ñòàòüè, êàêîãî-òî æóðíàëèñòà?
Ïî÷åìó, åñëè ýòè èññëåäîâàíèÿ ôèêöèÿ, ñðåäè àâòîðîâ, íàïðèìåð,

DR. KANEMATSU SUGIURA, M.D.
Researcher of the Sloan-Kettering Institute for Cancer Research
New York, U.S.A.

DR. HAROLD MANNER
Director of Research of the Department of Biology
Loyola University, Chicago, Illinois

È çà÷åì, íàêîíåö, îòïåòûì æóëèêàì, èìåòü â ñâîåì ãîñïèòàëå òðè îïåðàöèîííûõ, à Dr. Francisco Contreras (ñûíó) ñïåöèàëèçèðîâàòüñÿ â õèðóðãè÷åñêîé îíêîëîãèè â Âåíå (specialized in surgical oncology (cancer surgery) in Vienna, Austria)?

Åù¸ ðàç, íå ìîãó ñóäèòü, (íå çíàþ, ñëèøêîì ìàëî îáúåêòèâíûõ äàííûõ) î ñðàâíèòåëüíîé ýôôåêòèâíîñòè ëå÷åíèÿ â Oasis Hospital. Íî âîò äàòü íðàâñòâåííóþ îöåíêó î÷åðåäíûì çàî÷íûì õàðàêòåðèñòèêàì ñîâåðøåííî íåçíàêîìûõ âðà÷åé, êàê îòïåòûõ æóëèêîâ, ñäåëàííûõ íà îñíîâàíèè çàêàçíûõ ïàñêâèëåé, èìåþòñÿ âñå îñíîâàíèÿ.
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