#1
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Åñòü ëè ñðàâíèòåëüíîé òàáëèöû âèàãðû, ñèàëèñà, ëåâèòðû, äèíàìèêî?
Ìîäåðèðîâàíî
Íåò ëè êàêîé-íèáóäü ñðàâíèòåëüíîé òàáëèöû, ãäå ñâåäåíû âìåñòå ñâîéñòâà ïîäîáíûõ ëåêàðñòâ (âèàãðû, ñèàëèñà, ëåâèòðû è äèíàìèêî)? À òî ïðåïàðàòîâ ìíîãî, à âûáîð äàëåêî íå î÷åâèäåí. Çàðàíåå ñïàñèáî çà îòâåò! |
#2
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Äåéñòâóþùåå íà÷àëî äèíàìèêî òàêîå æå êàê â âèàãðå. Íè÷åãî íîâîãî.
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Ñ óâàæåíèåì, Þñèô Àëõàçîâ. |
#3
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Ïðîäîëæèòåëüíîñòü äåéñòâèÿ: âèàãðà < ëåâèòðà < ñèàëèñ (ñèàëèñ ñàìûé äîëãîäåéñòâóþùèé).
Ïîáî÷íûå ýôôåêòû (ñåðäöå è ò.ï.): âèàãðà > ñèàëèñ > ëåâèòðà (ëåâèòðà âðîäå êàê ñàìàÿ áåçîïàñíàÿ). Äèíàìèêî òóò óêàçàíî çðÿ, ò.ê. ýòî âñåãî ëèøü ãåíåðèê âèàãðû îò þãîñëàâñêîé Ïëèâû (ìîæåò ïîòðåáîâàòüñÿ áîëüøå äîçà äëÿ äîñòèæåíèÿ òîãî æå ýôôåêòà).
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷ ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ |
#4
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Öèòàòà:
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#5
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Öèòàòà:
1. Äæåíåðèê íèêîãäà íå áûâàåò "ïîëíûì àíàëîãîì", åñëè âûïóùåí íå ïî ëèöåíçèè ðàçðàáîò÷èêà îðèãèíàëüíîé ìîëåêóëû. Íå ïåðåäåðãèâàéòå. 2. )) Ïëèâó ñíà÷àëà êóïèëà êîìïàíèÿ Áàðð, ïîòîì Áàðð êóïèëà êîìïàíèÿ Òåâà. Çàâîä â Þãîñëàâèè íèêóäà íå äåëñÿ. Ìíå íå âàæíî êòî "âûâîäèò" ïðåïàðàò íà ðûíîê, ìíå âàæíî ãäå ïðåïàðàò ïðîèçâåäåí (à ýòî çàâîä Ïëèâà â Þãîñëàâèè). Þãîñëàâñêîå êà÷åñòâî ñèëüíî óñòóïàåò êà÷åñòâó èçðàèëüñêîìó èëè íåìåöêîìó. Åñëè êîïàòü åùå ãëóáæå, òî â Þãîñëàâèè ïðàêòè÷åñêè íå èçãîòàâëèâàþòñÿ ñóáñòàíöèè ëåêàðñòâ, ò.å. ñêîðåå âñåãî ñóáñòàíöèÿ èõ ãåíåðèêà èíäèéñêîãî èëè êèòàéñêîãî ïðîèñõîæäåíèÿ. À ýòî åùå áîëüøèé óðîí êà÷åñòâó. Ò.å. êàê ÿ è ïèñàë: "ìîæåò ïîòðåáîâàòüñÿ áîëüøå äîçà äëÿ äîñòèæåíèÿ òîãî æå ýôôåêòà"!!! 3. Âû íå â Òåâå ñëó÷àéíî òðóäèòåñü? Åñëè â íåé, òî ñòûäíî íå çíàòü èñòîðèþ ñâîåé êîìïàíèè
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷ ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ |
#6
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Öèòàòà:
Îäíàêî ïî ðàáîòå ñòàëêèâàþñü ñ íèìè - êàê âïðî÷åì, è ìíîãèìè äðóãèìè. 2. Þãîñëàâèè êàê ñòðàíû íå ñóùåñòâóåò, Ïëèâà - õîðâàòñêîå ïðîèçâîäñòâî, ðàáîòàåò ïî åâðîïåéñêèì ñòàíäàðòàì, è íåñåò îòâåòñòâåííîñòü ïî åâðîïåéñêèì êàíîíàì, êîòîðûå íå ñàìûå ãóìàííûå â îòíîøåíèè ôàðìàêîëîãè÷åñêîãî ïðîèçâîäñòâà â ìèðå. 1. Äæåíåðèê íå ÿâëÿåòñÿ ïîëíûì àíàëîãîì, íî ïðè ýòîì îí îòíþäü íå îáÿçàòåëüíî õóæå (à ïîä÷àñ è ãîðàçäî ëó÷øå). Ê ïðèìåðó, èñïàíñêèå âëàñòè ÎÁßÇÀËÈ ñâîèõ âðà÷åé ðåêîìåíäîâàòü ïàöèåíòàì íå îðèãèíàëüíûå ïðåïàðàòû, à äæåíåðèêè, ÷òîáû ëþäè íå ïåðåïëà÷èâàëè. Âû ñ÷èòàåòå, ÷òî èñïàíñêèå âëàñòè æåëàþò çëà ñâîèì æèòåëÿì? |
#7
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Çà íå èìåíèåì ãåðáîâîé áóìàãè ïèøóò íà îáû÷íîé, òóò ñîãëàñåí. Ãåíåðèêè - ðåøåíèå ïðîáëåìû äîñòóïíîñòè äëÿ áåäíîòû è äëÿ ãîñ.ïðîãðàìì
Öèòàòà:
Èëè àâòîìîáèëü ñîáðàííûé ïîä Ëåíèíãðàäîì è â ÑØÀ ×òî åñòü "åâðîïåéñêèå ñòàíäàðòû"? Âû çíàåòå êàêèå îðãàíèçàöèè ñåðòèôèöèðîâàëè ýòîò çàâîä? ß íå çíàþ. Îòâåòñòâåííîñòü ïî "åâðîïåéñêèì êàíîíàì" - ýòî ÷òî è êàê? Åñëè áû ýòîò çàâîä ïîñòàâëÿë õîòü ÷òî-òî â Çàïàäíóþ Åâðîïó, òî èõ áû ïðèçûâàëè ê îòâåñòâåííîñòè... Àíàëîãèÿ äëÿ ïîíèìàíèÿ: Ñàíîôè äåëàåò íà çàâîäå Õèíîèí (Âåíãðèÿ) íîøïó, êîòîðóþ ïîòðåáëÿåò òîëüêî áûâøèé ñîö.ëàãåðü è êîòîðóþ íå íàéòè íà Çàïàäå. Öèòàòà:
Íàäåþñü, ÷òî Âû ñàìè íå âåðèòå â òî, ÷òî íàïèñàëè, åñëè èíà÷å, òî Âàì íóæíî äîïîëíèòåëüíîå îáðàçîâàíèå (èëè ñàìîîáðàçîâàíèå?!) ïî ýòîìó âîïðîñó äëÿ òîãî, ÷òîáû èçáàâèòñÿ îò ðîçîâûõ î÷êîâ. ×òî òàêîå ãåíåðèê? Ýòî èíäèéñêàÿ èëè êèòàéñêàÿ ñóáñòàíöèÿ, ïðîèçâåäåííàÿ, êàê ïðàâèëî, áåç êîíòðîëÿ (â ïîãîíå çà äåøåâèçíîé). Äåøåâûì òðàíñïîðòîì ïðèâåçåííàÿ ê ìåñòó ôàñîâêè â áî÷êàõ èëè ÿùèêàõ. Ëüâèíàÿ äîëÿ öåíû ãåíåðèêà - ñòîèìîñòü óïàêîâêè. Ïîñìîòðèòå íà ñàéòå [Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ] êà÷åñòâî ãåíåðèêîâ, ïîââîäèâ èõ íàçâàíèÿ èëè íàçâàíèÿ ãåíåðè÷åñêèõ ôèðì. Óäà÷è!
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷ ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ |
#8
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Öèòàòà:
Îäíàêî ïðåäïîëàãàòü, ÷òî êîìïàíèÿ Teva, îäíà èç ñàìûõ êðóïíûõ è ñîëèäíûõ êîìïàíèé íà ôàðìàöåâòè÷åñêîì ðûíêå áóäåò ôàñîâàòü íåèçâåñòíî ÷òî, ñäåëàííîå â Èíäèè èëè Êèòàå íà ìîé âçãëÿä ñìåøíî. È òî, ÷òî áîëüøàÿ ÷àñòü äæåíåðèêîâ (âî âñÿêîì ñëó÷àå ó íàñ) äåéñòâèòåëüíî â îñíîâå ñâîåé öåíû èìåþò óïàêîâêó/äîñòàâêó/ôàñîâêó îòíþäü íå îçíà÷àåò, ÷òî òàê âñåãäà è âåçäå. Íàñêîëüêî ÿ çíàþ, òà æå Ïôàéçåð íå ãíóøàåòñÿ âûïóñêàòü äæåíåðèêè ïðåïàðàòîâ äðóãèõ êîìïàíèé, è âîîáùå íèêòî èç êðóïíûõ èãðîêîâ íå ãíóøàåòñÿ. Ó âàñ æå ïîëó÷àåòñÿ, ÷òî ëþáàÿ ôàðìàöåâòè÷åñêàÿ êîìïàíèÿ, êîòîðàÿ äåëàåò ýòî, àâòîìàòè÷åñêè çàìàðàíà â ïðîèçâîäñòâå ÷åãî-òî çàâåäîìî äåøåâîãî è íåêà÷åñòâåííîãî. Ëè÷íî ÿ ïî óáåæäåíèÿì ïðîòèâíèê ìîíîïîëèè â ëþáîé ñôåðå, è äëÿ ìåíÿ âàøà ïîçèöèÿ êàæåòñÿ íåïðèåìëåìîé ïî ñâîåé ñóòè. |
#9
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Ôàéçåð è Íîâàðòèñ äåëàþò ãåíåðèêè, íî êîíòðîëèðóþò ïðîöåññ íà âñåõ ýòàïàõ, êà÷åñòâî èõ ãåíåðèêîâ ïðèåìëèìîå è ïðîâåðÿåòñÿ FDA.
Âû æå ëèøü ñîîáùàåòå, ÷òî Òåâà - "îäíà èç ñàìûõ êðóïíûõ è ñîëèäíûõ êîìïàíèé íà ôàðìàöåâòè÷åñêîì ðûíêå", íå ïðèâîäÿ íèêàêèõ äðóãèõ äîêàçàòåëüñòâ. À ýòî - âñåãî ëèøü ñõîëàñòèêà. Ïîâòîðþ, þãîñëàâñêèé çàâîä Ïëèâà ïðîèçâîäèò ëåêàðñòâà äëÿ ñîö.ëàãåðÿ, êîíòðîëü êà÷åòâà íà ýòîì çàâîäå ìíå íå èçâåñòåí. Ëåãêî íàçâàòü ÷òî-òî "íåïðèåìëèìûì ïî ñóòè", ëèøü áû íå ïîâûøàòü îáðàçîâàíèå Ñïîðèòü, äåéñòâèòåëüíî, íå î ÷åì, ò.ê. Âû (çàìåòüòå: ÿ âñåãäà ïèøó ýòî ìåñòîèìåíèå ñ áîëüøîé áóêâû) íå ïðèâîäèòå àðãóìåíòîâ, à îòâå÷àåòå â äóõå Â.È.Ëåíèíà "ýòà òåîðèÿ âåðíàÿ, ïîòîìó ÷òî åäèíñòâåííî ïðàâèëüíàÿ" Âñå Âàøè ñîîáùåíèÿ íà ýòîì ôîðóìå îãðàíè÷åíû ýòîé òåìîé, Âû è ðåãèñòðèðîâàëèñü, âåðîÿòíî, ëèøü äëÿ òîãî, ÷òîáû âñòóïèòüñÿ çà áûâøóþ Þãîñëàâèþ
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷ ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ |
#10
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Áîëüøîå ñïàñèáî Àëåêñàíäðó Èâàíîâè÷ó è äðóãèì ó÷àñòíèêàì îáñóæäåíèÿ! ß òåïåðü ïðÿìî ñïåö ïî âîïðîñó. Åñëè ñåðüåçíî, ÷åì õîðîøè ôîðóìû - íà ñâîé âîïðîñ ïîëó÷àåøü îòâåòû ïî ñóòè - è áûñòðî. À åñëè ñåðôèòü â èíòåðíåòå, ÷åðåç ïîë÷àñà ãîëîâà èäåò êðóãîì îò âñÿêèõ ãðîìàäíûõ ñòàòåé, êàê ïðàâèëî, äðóã ó äðóãà ïåðåïå÷àòàííûõ.
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#11
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Êñòàòè, ñóäÿ ïî ïîñëåäíèì ñîîáùåíèÿì Äèíàìèêî â Ðîññèè çàïðåòÿò ê ïðîäàæå (òàê æå, êàê çàïðåòèëè â Øòàòàõ è ïðî÷èõ öèâèëèçîâàííûõ ìåñòàõ). Ïôàéçåð ïîäàë â ñóä íà Òåâó è ñóä, ñêîðåå âñåãî, âûèãðàåò.
Äóìàþ, îíî è ïðàâèëüíî - âèàãðà îáùåäîñòóïíà, à ìàññîâî èñïîëüçîâàòü òàêîé ìóòíûé ïðåïàðàò ñîâñåì íå ñòîèò. |
#12
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Ê âîïðîñó î ãåíåðèêàõ - èç ïîñëåäíåé ïî÷òû:
Brand-Name Versus Generic AEDs: Are They Really Any Different? Analysis of bioequivalence studies suggests that switching between brand-name and generic antiepileptic drugs is relatively safe but that generic-to-generic switching might increase the risk for adverse effects. A major concern for epilepsy patients and their caregivers is the switch from brand-name antiepilepsy drugs (AEDs) to generic formulations. Switching to or starting on generic AEDs has become mandatory for the vast majority of epilepsy patients in the U.S., since nearly all the newer-generation AEDs are now available in generic formulations. These authors analyzed bioequivalence studies required for Abbreviated New Drug Applications submitted to the FDA, obtained via Freedom of Information Act requests, to answer the central question of whether generic AEDs are accurate copies of brand-name drugs. They also addressed whether switches between generic formulations are safe and effective. Data from 141 generic formulations of the following AEDs were analyzed: carbamazepine, divalproex, gabapentin, lamotrigine, topiramate, levetiracetam, oxcarbazepine, and zonisamide. Between generic and brand-name formulations, total drug concentration differences were less than 15% for nearly all bioequivalence studies (98.8%). Peak drug concentrations differed more — by 15% to 25% in 10.85% of studies. Variability in distributions for both measures was similar between formulations. Because generic–generic switches were not studied, the authors conducted simulation studies of all possible generic substitutions for other generic AEDs. In these simulations, total drug concentrations differed by 15% to 25% for 14.3% of the comparisons, and peak drug concentrations differed by that much for 35.1% of the comparisons. (The other comparisons showed smaller differences.) The authors conclude that total drug delivery for generic carbamazepine, divalproex, and newer-generation AEDs is comparable to reference brand-name drugs, but that substitutions between generic AEDs may not be well-tolerated by some patients. Comment: These findings are very important because they should at least begin to put to rest what has at times been a contentious debate about the safety and efficacy of relatively inexpensive generic substitutes for brand-name epilepsy drugs. However, the study findings also show that another concern about generic AEDs is valid: The variation in generic–generic substitutions is potentially significant. Simulations of these substitutions reveal that a substantial minority of patients might experience adverse effects from a relatively large variation in peak drug concentrations if numerous generic formulation changes occur. The data do not indicate any clear risk for "breakthrough" seizures from switching between generics. The findings may not apply to children or to older populations, who were not subjects in most of the bioequivalence studies. Because of the potential risk for altered effectiveness with generic–generic switches, patients, their caregivers, or their physicians may want to ask their pharmacies to maintain generic formulation consistency as much as possible. — Robert C. Knowlton, MD, MSPH Published in Journal Watch Neurology October 4, 2011 Citation(s): Krauss GL et al. Assessing bioequivalence of generic antiepilepsy drugs. Ann Neurol 2011 Aug; 70:221. |
#13
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Íàøåë ñðàâíåíèå Âèàãðû, Ñèàëèñà è Ëåâèòðû
Ìîäåðèðîâàíî
Âîò òàáëèöà ñðàâíèòåëüíàÿ èõ äæåíåðèêîâ. |
#14
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Âèàãðà, Ñèàëèñ è Ëåâèòðà - ýòî òîðãîâûå íàçâàíèÿ îðèãèíàëüíûõ ïðåïàðàòîâ, ïîýòîìó ïðèêðåïëÿòü ïîä íèìè ôîòî íåâåäîìûõ áëèñòåðîâ è ïèñàòü, ÷òî ñäåëàíî â Èíäèè - íå êîððåêòíî.
Ïðî QT íå óêàçàíî íè ñëîâà â òàáëèöå, à âàðäåíàôèë åñòü âî âñåõ ïëîõèõ ñïèñêàõ ïî QT.
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Àëåêñàíäð Èâàíîâè÷ ñ ïîæåëàíèÿìè êðåïêîãî çäîðîâüÿ |