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Âåðíóòüñÿ   Äèñêóññèîííûé Êëóá Ðóññêîãî Ìåäèöèíñêîãî Ñåðâåðà > Ôîðóìû âðà÷åáíûõ êîíñóëüòàöèé > Íåâðîëîãèÿ è íåéðîõèðóðãèÿ

Íåâðîëîãèÿ è íåéðîõèðóðãèÿ Ôîðóìû: Ôîðóì äëÿ îáùåíèÿ âðà÷åé íåâðîëîãîâ è íåéðîõèðóðãîâ, Ìàíóàëüíàÿ òåðàïèÿ

Îòâåò
 
Îïöèè òåìû Ïîèñê â ýòîé òåìå Îïöèè ïðîñìîòðà
  #1  
Ñòàðûé 15.07.2004, 23:05
NILA NILA âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Ñåðôåð
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 15.07.2004
Ãîðîä: Áåëàðóñü
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3
NILA *
Unhappy Ïîñòîÿííî áîëèò ãîëîâà

Íèëà ,39 ëåò.Ãîëîâíûå áîëè åù¸ ñ äåòñòâà. þíîñòè áûâàëè ìó÷èòåëüíûå ìèãðåíè-1-2 ðàçà â ìåñÿö.Ñïàñàë áàðàëãèí,ñïàçìàëãîí.Ïîñëåäíèå 4 ãîäà ãîëîâà áîëèò ïî÷òè ïîñòîÿííî.Êàæäîå óòðî-òÿæ¸ëàÿ ãîëîâà,õîòÿ è âûñûïàþñü,ñ òóïîé íå î÷åíü ñèëüíîé áîëüþ íàäåòîãî øëåìà.Áîëÿò ãëàçà-êàê-áóäòî ÷òî-òî äàâèò íà ãëàçí.ÿáëîêè.Ïî÷òè ïîñòîÿííûé øóì èëè çâîí â óøàõ,ãîëîâîêðóæåíèå,íî íå ñèëüíîå.Çàâåðøåíèå ïî íàðàñòàþùåé ìèãðåíüþ-ïðèìåðíî ðàç â äâå íåäåëè.Ïîìîãàåò ãîðÿ÷àÿ ãðåëêà íà îáë. âîðîòíèêîâîé çîíû,ñîëïàäåèí,èíîãäà ñïàçãàí+öèòðàìîí.Òóïàÿ íåñèëüíàÿ áîëü íå ñíèìàåòñÿ íè÷åì,ìîæåò òîëüêî îñëàáåâàòü-åñëè åé íå ñîïðîòèâëÿòüñÿ.
Ãëàçíîå äíî:àðòåðèè ñóæåíû,êàêèå-òî äèñêè â íîðìå,ïîëÿ çðåíèÿ-â íîðìå.Ðåýíöåôàëîãðàììà:ïîâûøåíû àðòåðèàëüíîå êðîâåíàïîëíåíèå,òîíóñ àðòåðèé è èõ ñêîðîñòü íàïîëíåíèÿ.,ñíèæåíà ýëàñòè÷íîñòü ìàãèñòð. àðòåðèé,âåíîçí. îòòîê ñîõðàí¸í.
Ñòîèò ëè ñäåëàòü ÌÐÒ(íåâðîïàòîëîã ñ÷èòàåò ëèøíèì)??
Îí ïîñîâåòîâàë àëçîëàì,íî âåäü ñïàçì ýòî íå ñíèìåò.
Ðàíüøå ïðèíèìàëà íîîòðîïèë.
Óñòàëà æèòü ñ áîëüþ,î÷åíü ìåøàåò.×òî äåëàòü?
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #2  
Ñòàðûé 16.07.2004, 03:25
Nikishov Nikishov âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Ñåðôåð
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 03.07.2004
Ãîðîä: ã.Êàëèíèíãðàä
Ñîîáùåíèé: 6
Nikishov ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïëîõóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Wink

Óâàæàåìàÿ NILA!!! Î÷åíü ïîõîæå íà Âåðòåáðîáàçèëÿðíóþ íåäîñòàòî÷íîñòü.Î÷åíü õîðîøèå ðåçóëüòàòû ëå÷åíèÿ îçîíîòåðàïèåé (ÿ ýòèì çàíèìàþñü ;à êàê ó Âàñ â Áåëîðóñè ñ îçîíîòåðàïèåé?).Ïîäðîáíîñòè ïî Å:MAIL

Êîììåíòàðèè ê ñîîáùåíèþ:
Dobro íå îäîáðèë(à): áðåä
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #3  
Ñòàðûé 16.07.2004, 09:09
Mikhail Mikhail âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 02.12.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,214
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 3
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 121 ðàç(à) çà 119 ñîîáùåíèé
Mikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Óâàæàåìàÿ Íèëà!
Íåñêîëüêî âîïðîñîâ:
1. Áîëü â ãëàçàõ ñäàâëèâàþùàÿ èëè ðàñïèðàþùàÿ?
2. Áûâàåò ëè ðâîòà íà âûñîòå áîëè?
3. ×òî â Âàøåì ïîíÿòèè ÌÈÃÐÅÍÜ? (áîëèò 1/2 ãîëîâû èëè âñÿ, åñòü ëè ñâåòî è çâóêîáîÿçíü âî âðåìÿ "ìèãðåíè"?)
4.Êàêèå ïðåïàðàòû ïîìîãàþò ñíÿòü ïðîñòî áîëü è ìèãðåíü?
5.Åñòü ëè ñâÿçü ñ ìåñÿ÷íûìè?
6. Ìíîãî ëè Âû ðàáîòàåòå? Îáñòàíîâêà â ñåìüå?
7. Êóðèòå?
8. Åñòü ëè ïàòîëîãè÷åñêèå èçìåíåíèÿ â îáùåì àíàëèçå êðîâè, è ïî äðóãèì îðãàíàì è ñèñòåìàì? Õðîíè÷åñêèå áîëåçíè?

Åñëè íå ñëîæíî, îïèñûâàéòå èíòåíñèâíîñòü áîëè ïî 10 áàëüíîé øêàëå, ãäå 10 áàëîâ- ìàêñ. èíòåíñèâíîñòü, êàêóþ òîëüêî ìîæíî ïðåäñòàâèòü, à 0 áàëëîâ - íåò áîëè.

Äëÿ íà÷àëà ñäåëàéòå ðåíòãåíîãðàôèþ øåéíîãî îòäåëà ïîçâîíî÷íèêà ñ ôóíêöèîíàëüíûìè ñíèìêàìè - (ïðè íàêëîíå ãîëîâû è ïðè ðàçãèáàíèè).
Æåëàòåëüíî ÓÇÄÃ èëè (ëó÷øå) Äóïëåêñíîå ñêàíèðîâàíèå.
Ïîòîì ðåøèì íàñ÷åò ÊÒ/ÌÐÒ.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #4  
Ñòàðûé 21.07.2004, 18:25
NILA NILA âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Ñåðôåð
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 15.07.2004
Ãîðîä: Áåëàðóñü
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3
NILA *
Ñïàñèáî Âàì áîëüøîå çàîòêëèê.Áûëà çà ãîðîäîì âñå ýòî âðåìÿ,ãîëîâà ïî÷òè íå áîëåëà(0,5 áàëëà)-ïðîñòî ìîíîòîííî-òÿæåëàÿ ãîëîâà.
Îòâåòû:
1.Äàâÿùàÿ áîëü íà ãëàçà èçâíå
2.Ðâîòû íå áûâàëî,òîëüêî òîøíîòà
3."Ìèãðåíü":áîëèò ïîëãîëîâû,÷àùå ëåâàÿ,ïóëüñèðóåò âèñîê èëè îáà,ìèíèìàëüíûé ñâåò è ëþáîé çâóê óñóãóáëÿþò áîëü(7-8)Ïàðó ëåò íàçàä äîõîäèëî äî (9-10)-íåâîçìîæíî áûëî ñäåëàòü ëèøíåå äâèæåíèå..Åñëè ïðîâåñòè âîîáðàæàåìóþ îñü îò ëåâîãî ê ïðàâîìó âèñêó,òî èñò-ê íà 1.3 ðàññòîÿíèÿ(â ïîñëåäíèé ðàç),îò ýòîé òî÷êè ëó÷àìè ïîðàäèóñàì âîëíîîáðàçíî ðàñïðîñòð.áîëü-êàê êðóãè ïî âîäå.Òåì íå ìåíåå øëåì îñòàâàëñÿ-,íî âòîðàÿ ïîëîâèíà áîëèò â 3ðàçà ìåíüøå.(âñ¸-òàêè êîëè÷-íî îöåíèâàòü ñëîæíî)Èíîãäà áîëü â ïðàâîé ïîëîâèíå-êàê áóäò èñòî÷íèê-òî÷êà â íåé.Ïðèñòóï íà÷èíàëñÿ áëèæå ê âå÷åðó-òîãäà è íî÷üþ áîëèò.Íàóòðî ãîëîâà ë¸ãêàÿ-êàæåòñÿ òðîíü-çàçâåíèò.
Âûçâàòü ñèëüíóþ áîëü ìîæåò êðàòêîâðåì.âäûõàíèå áåíçèíà-íà çàïðâêå,èíîãäà-ñúåäåííîå ìîðîæåíîå.×àñòî ìåðçíóò ðóêè è íîãè äàæå â òåïëîå âðåìÿ ãîäà-õîòÿ âñå îòíîñèòåëüíî-ýòî òîæå ïðîâîöèðóåò ñèëüíóþ áîëü,ê-ðàÿ ïåðåõîäèò èç ìîåé ïî÷òè ïîñòîÿííîé òÿæåëî -ìîíîòîííîé çâåíÿùåé(0,5-1) .Òáà÷íûé äûì-äàæå âòå÷ 15 ìèíóò
4.Ëåãêàÿ áîëü(1) íå ñíèìàåòñÿ,ïî êð.ìåðå öèòðàìîíîì
Ìèãðåíü-(îò7 äî 9)-ñîëïàäåèíîì è ñïàçãàíîì îáëåã÷àåòñÿ(äî 3)
5.Ïåðåä êðèòè÷.äíÿìè è âïåðâûé äåíü(8-9_Ïîòîì íå áîëèò âîîáùå,ïîñëå îêîí÷àíèÿ-òÿæåñòü è ëåãêèé øëåì(1-2)
6,ðàáîòàþ íå ìíîãî ,â èþíå íå ðàáîòàëà âîîáùå-áîëè îñòàâàëèñü.Äåïðåññèÿ ïîñëå îñåííåãî ðàçâîäà è çà ãîä äî íåãî.Äî ýòîãî òîæå áîëè áûëè.
7.Êóðþ-òîíåíüêèå ë¸ãêèå,ñíà÷àëà ïîìîãàëî â ïå÷àëèÏàðó øòóê â äåíü.
8.ÎÁùèé àí-ç êðîâè-â íîðìå.Ïìê 1 ñòåï.,æåëóäî÷ê.ýêñòðîñèñòîëèÿ.Ïðè ìîíèòîðèðîâàíèè: ýêñòð. îäèíî÷íàÿ 14926,ïàðíàÿ 4
Ýóòèðèîèäíûé óçëîâîé çîá 1 ñòåï.Ïåðåøååê 0Á3 ñì.ËÄ 1.5õ1.4õ4.8 ñì ÖÄ 1.6õ1.4õ4.5 ñì ,ñòð. íåîäíîð. Âñòð.ËÄýõîíåãàòèâíîå îáðàçîâàíèå 1.0 ñì.
Ôèáðîìàò. óçåëîê â ìàòêå(ðàçì ñ ãîðîøèíó-ñ 1991 ãîäà è ñåé÷àñ),ýíäîìåòðèîç_ïîäðîáíîñòè ,íàâåðíî íå íóæíû ïîêà.Ïèñàëà è ÷óâñòâîâàëà ñåáÿ èíâàëèäîì.Íî ýòî ìíå íå ìåøàåò.À âîò ãîëîâà!
Ðåíòãåíîãðàôèþ è ñêàíèð-èå åù¸ íå äåëàëà.



















ôèáðîìàòîçí.óçåëîê â ìàòêå(
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #5  
Ñòàðûé 22.07.2004, 09:32
Mikhail Mikhail âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 02.12.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,214
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 3
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 121 ðàç(à) çà 119 ñîîáùåíèé
Mikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Óâàæàåìàÿ Íèëà,
ñïàñèáî çà ïîäðîáíîå îïèñàíèå. (âñå áû ïàöèåíòû òàêèå áû áûëè )

Âåðîÿòíåå âñåãî ó Âàñ ñî÷åòàíèå (íåðåäêî âñòðå÷àþùååñÿ) êëàññè÷åñêîé ìèãðåíè ñ õðîíè÷åñêîé ãîëîâíîé áîëüþ íàïðÿæåíèÿ.
Âîçìîæíî, ïîñòîÿííàÿ íîþùàÿ áîëü òàêæå îáóñëîâëåíà íåâðîëîãè÷åñêèìè ïðîÿâëåíèÿìè îñòåîõäðîçà ïîçâîíî÷íèêà (äëÿ óòî÷íåíèÿ - îïÿòü æå ñíèìîê ñ ÔÓÍÊÖÈÎÍÀËÜÍÛÌÈ ÏÐÎÁÀÌÈ!). Îòñþäà ìîóò áûòü è ãîëîâîêðóæåíèÿ (ñäåëàéòå ÓÇÄÃ).

Ëå÷åíèå íà÷èíàþò ñ ÍÏÂÑ+öåíòàðëüíûå ìèîðåëàêñàíòû!. Ïðè ïðèñòóïàõ ìèãðåíè ìîãóò ïîìî÷ü òðèïòàíû, íî åñëè Âàì ïîìîãàåò ïàðàöåòàìîë, òî åãî è ïðèíìàéòå.
×àñòî ê ëå÷åíèþ äîáàâëÿþò àíòèäåïðåññàíòû (÷òî Âàì è õîòåë íàçíà÷èòü Âàø âðà÷). Íî ÈÌÕÎ ñ íèìè ëó÷øå íå òîðîïèòüñÿ. (Õîòÿ è îòêàçûâàòüñÿ íå ñòîèò, åñëè ýòî íåîáõîäèìî).

×òî êàñàåòñÿ ìåòîäîâ íåéðîâèçóàëèçàöèè - â ïðèíöèïå, áûëî áû õîðîøî ñäåëàòü õîòÿ áû ÊÒ. Çà ðóáåæîì ëþáàÿ äëèòåëüíàÿ ãîëîâíàÿ áîëü - ïîêàçàíèå ê òàêîìó èññëåäîâàíèþ. Åñëè âîçìîæíîñòü ôèíàíñîâàÿ åñòü, ëó÷øå ñäåëàòü. Ýêîíîìè÷íåå - ÊÒ.  âûÿâëåíèè ÍÀËÈ×Èß çàáîëåâàíèé, ïîòåíöèàëüíî âûçûâàþùèõ ãîëîâíóþ áîëü îíà âïîëíå èíôîðìàòèâíà.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #6  
Ñòàðûé 22.07.2004, 11:41
Mikhail Mikhail âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 02.12.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,214
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 3
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 121 ðàç(à) çà 119 ñîîáùåíèé
Mikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
 äîïîëíåíèå õî÷ó ïîìåñòèòü ëþáåçíî ïðåäîñòàâëåííûé Âàäèìîì Âàëåðüåâè÷åì àáñòðàêò, îïóáëèêîâàííûé èì íà Ñîëâååâñêîì ôîðóìå.

Efficacy of 1,000 mg Effervescent Acetylsalicylic Acid and Sumatriptan in Treating Associated Migraine Symptoms.

Diener HC, Eikermann A, Gessner U, Gobel H, Haag G, Lange R, May A, Muller-Schwefe G, Voelker M.

Department of Neurology, University of Essen, Essen, Germany.

Recently a new effervescent acetylsalicylic acid (ASA) tablet with high buffering capacity has been developed. In this double-blind, 3-arm, multicenter, parallel-group study, 433 patients were treated either with 1,000 mg effervescent ASA or 50 mg encapsulated sumatriptan or placebo. The primary endpoint was the percentage of patients with complete remission of the 3 accompanying symptoms nausea, photophobia and phonophobia within 2 h after intake of the study drug. 43.8% of patients treated with ASA, 43.7% of patients treated with sumatriptan and 30.9% of patients treated with placebo showed complete remission of all 3 accompanying symptoms (p < 0.05 for ASA and sumatriptan vs. placebo). Both active treatments were superior to placebo regarding the individual symptoms photophobia and phonophobia, but not for nausea. The percentage of patients with reduction in headache severity from moderate or severe to mild or no pain (secondary objective) was 49.3% for ASA, 48.8% for sumatriptan and 32.9% for placebo. All active treatments were superior to placebo (p < 0.05). 25.3, 24.4 and 14.5% of patients treated with ASA, sumatriptan or placebo were pain free at 2 h. Drug-related adverse events were reported in 3.9, 4.7 and 6.7% of patients treated with placebo, ASA or sumatriptan. The study showed that administration of effervescent ASA leads to remission of the migraine symptoms nausea, photophobia and phonophobia, reduces migraine headache and is comparable to sumatriptan.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #7  
Ñòàðûé 22.07.2004, 15:40
NILA NILA âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë æåíñêèé
Ñåðôåð
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 15.07.2004
Ãîðîä: Áåëàðóñü
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3
NILA *
Óâàæàåìûé Ìèõàèë,áîëüøîå ñïàñèáî.Îáñëåäóþñü,à ïîêà àëçîëàì (0.25ìã) íà íî÷ü íå áóäó.
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Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #8  
Ñòàðûé 22.07.2004, 15:45
Mikhail Mikhail âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Âåòåðàí ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 02.12.2001
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 3,214
Ñêàçàë(à) ñïàñèáî: 3
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 121 ðàç(à) çà 119 ñîîáùåíèé
Mikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåMikhail ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
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