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Îòâåò
 
Îïöèè òåìû Ïîèñê â ýòîé òåìå Îïöèè ïðîñìîòðà
  #16  
Ñòàðûé 28.06.2005, 05:04
Àâàòàð äëÿ bill
 bill  bill âíå ôîðóìà
ÂÐÀ×
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 29.03.2003
Ãîðîä: Ñàíêò-Ïåòåðáóðã
Ñîîáùåíèé: 4,445
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 212 ðàç(à) çà 131 ñîîáùåíèé
bill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåbill ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò pandoc
Íåáîëüøàÿ îáçîðíàÿ ñòàòüÿ î ïåðñïåêòèâàõ êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè:
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Íåñìîòðÿ íà ýíòóçèàçì àâòîðà â îòíîøåíèè êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè,âîïðîñ î åãî âíåäðåíèè â êëèíè÷åñêóþ ïðàêòèêó îñòàåòñÿ îòêðûòûì. Ãåðìàíèè ,ïðè ñàìûõ áëàãîïðèÿòíèõ óñëîâèÿõ (óñïåøíîãî ïðîõîæäåíèÿ âñåõ íåîáõîäèìûõ ñòàäèé êëèíè÷åñêèõ èñïûòàíèé) îí ìîæåò áûòü äîïóøåí ê êëèíè÷åñêîìó ïðèìåíåíèþ íå ðàíüøå ÷åì ÷åðåç 4-6 ëåò è ïîñëå ýòîãî ÷åðåç 3-10 ëåò â ÑØÀ.À ïîêà Ðîññèéñêèå ñòàëåâàðû-ñòàõàíîâöû ìîãóò èçúÿòü êñåíîí èç àòìîñôåðû ïî 10 Åâðî çà ëèòð è ïðîäàòü åãî äîðîæå.êîãäà ïîÿâèòñÿ ðåàëüíûé ñïðîñ.Êñòàòè,ÑØÀ íå ïîäïèñàëè Êèîòñêèé ïðîòîêîë.Áàøêîâèòûé Áóø ñî ñâîèìè ïîäåëüíèêàìè ñ÷èòàåò ÷òî íèêàêîãî ãëîáàëüíîãî ïîòåïëåíèÿ íåò ,òàê æå êàê è ýâîëþöèè (â Äàðâèíîâñêîì ñìûñëå).
Íó âîò, òàê ÿ è äóìàë.
Êëèíè÷åñêèå èñïûòàíèÿ, äîêàçàòåëüíîñòü â Ðîññèè ôèêöèÿ. Äåíåã äàëè, ïðîïèàðèëè è âñÿ ïðîáëåìà. Áëèí
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Ñ óâàæåíèåì
Âëàäèìèð Ìèõàéëîâè÷ Ïîäêîëçèí
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #17  
Ñòàðûé 29.06.2005, 14:32
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr. Makhotin
Dr. Makhotin Dr. Makhotin âíå ôîðóìà
Ïîñòîÿííûé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 11.10.2004
Ãîðîä: ã. Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 319
Dr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò pandoc
Çàïðåòèòü êåì è ãäå?Ïî÷åìó?È ÷åì çàìåíèòü?Êñåíîí,ïðè âñåé ñâîåé ïðèâëåêàòåëüíîñòè "èäåàëüíîãî àíåñòåòèêà"ïîêà íå ïðåäñòàâëÿåò ñîáîé ðåàëüíóþ ïîòåíöèàëüíóþ çàìåíó ñóùåñòâóþùèì èíãàëÿöèîííûì àíåñòåòèêàì.Ïðè÷èíà-îãðàíè÷åííûå çàïàñû êñåíîíà â àòìîñôåðå è íåñèíòåçèðóåìîñòü åãî ïðè ñîâðåìåííîì óðîâíå òåõíîëîãèè.Ïîýòîìó âåðîÿòíîñòü âíåçàïíîãî èëè ïîñòåïåííîãî ïîäåøåâëåíèÿ êñåíîíà êðàéíå íåâûñîêà.À ýêîíîìèêà,êàê èçâåñòíî,äîëæíà áûòü ýêîíîìíîé.
Ïî Êèîòñêîìó ïðîòîêîëó, êîòîðûé íàøà ñòðàíà ðàòèôèöèðîâàëà, ê 2030 ãîäó ïîä çàïðåòîì áóäóò ëåòó÷èå (ãàëîãåíèçèðîâàííûå) àíåñòåòèêè è çàêèñü àçîòà. Âïåðåäè 25 ëåò äëÿ íàó÷íûõ ðàçðàáîòîê, êñåíîí - ïîêà åäèíñòâåííàÿ àëüòåðíàòèâà.
Òóò ìû âïåðåäè ïëàíåòû âñåé, ïîñêîëüêó êñåíîí çàðåãèñòðèðîâàí â Ðîññèè â êà÷åñòâå ìåäèöèíñêîãî ãàçà. Ïðîáóéòå, äåðçàéòå, ïèøèòå â ïðåñòèæíûå æóðíàëû.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #18  
Ñòàðûé 29.06.2005, 14:35
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr. Makhotin
Dr. Makhotin Dr. Makhotin âíå ôîðóìà
Ïîñòîÿííûé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 11.10.2004
Ãîðîä: ã. Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 319
Dr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò bill
Óâàæàåìûå êîëëåãè!
Íà ñêîëüêî ÿ ïîíÿë êóïèðîâàíèå îïèéíîé àáñòèíåíöèè êñåíîíîì - î÷åðåäíîå ðîññèéñêîå èçîáðåòåíèå?


Ñàòàíà òàì ïðàâèò áàë.....
Ýòî ñêîðåå ñëåäñòâèå íåêîòîðîé ýéôîðèè è æåëàíèå âèäåòü â ïðåïàðàòå ïàíàöåþ.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #19  
Ñòàðûé 29.06.2005, 14:39
Àâàòàð äëÿ Dr. Makhotin
Dr. Makhotin Dr. Makhotin âíå ôîðóìà
Ïîñòîÿííûé ó÷àñòíèê
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 11.10.2004
Ãîðîä: ã. Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 319
Dr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåDr. Makhotin ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò reopoliglucin
Ñîâðåìåííûå òåõíîëîãèè äåëàþò êñåíîí âñå áîëåå äåøåâûì (ðåöèêëèíã, äà è íà ìåòàëëóðãè÷åñêèõ çàâîäàõ òåõíè÷åñêîãî êñåíîíà íåìàëî ìîæíî ñäåëàòü...)
Âû ïðàâû â ïëàíå ïðîèçâîäñòâà ó íàñ áîëüøå âîçìîæíîñòåé, ÷åì ó êàêîé-ëèáî ñòðàíû...
Åñëè áû ê ýòîìó â íàøåé ñòðàíå øèðîêî èñïîëüçîâàëàñü òåõíèêà íèçêîïîòî÷íîé àíåñòåçèè - öåíû áû íàì íå áûëî!
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #20  
Ñòàðûé 08.11.2005, 16:31
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Exclamation Êîíôåðåíöèÿ â äåêàáðå

Íàøåë â èíòåðíåòå èíôîðìàöèþ î êîíôåðåíöèè ïî ìåäèöèíñêîìó êñåíîíó
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ], êîìó èíòåðåñíî ìîãóò ïîñåòèòü. ß ïîéäó.

Âñåì óäà÷è.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #21  
Ñòàðûé 08.11.2005, 20:11
papadoctor papadoctor âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Êàíäèäàò â âåòåðàíû ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 27.03.2005
Ãîðîä: USA
Ñîîáùåíèé: 1,685
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 1 ðàç çà 1 ñîîáùåíèå
papadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò Hazards
Íàøåë â èíòåðíåòå èíôîðìàöèþ î êîíôåðåíöèè ïî ìåäèöèíñêîìó êñåíîíó
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ], êîìó èíòåðåñíî ìîãóò ïîñåòèòü. ß ïîéäó.

Âñåì óäà÷è.
Ïîäåëèòåñü ïîòîì âïå÷àòëåíèÿìè? À òî â äåêàáðå â Ìîñêâå î÷åíü ïðîõëàäíî
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #22  
Ñòàðûé 08.11.2005, 22:07
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Thumbs up Êîíå÷íî

Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò papadoctor
Ïîäåëèòåñü ïîòîì âïå÷àòëåíèÿìè? À òî â äåêàáðå â Ìîñêâå î÷åíü ïðîõëàäíî
Êîíå÷íî, íå âîïðîñ.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #23  
Ñòàðûé 08.11.2005, 22:11
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Question À êàê òàì â Øòàòàõ?

to papadoctor:

À åñëè íå ñåêðåò, â Øòàòàõ çàíèìàþòñÿ êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèåé?
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #24  
Ñòàðûé 08.11.2005, 22:17
pandoc
Ãîñòü
 
Ñîîáùåíèé: n/a
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò Hazards
to papadoctor:

À åñëè íå ñåêðåò, â Øòàòàõ çàíèìàþòñÿ êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèåé?
Çàíèìàòüñÿ òî çàíèìàþòñÿ,òîëüêî íå íà ëþäÿõ.Íà ëþäÿõ êñåíîí ïîêà áîëüøå íèãäå íå èñïîëüçóþò,êðîìå êàê â Ðîññèè.Ïðè÷åì òåõíè÷åñêèé,ïðÿìî îò ñòàëåâàðîb.Èíòåðåñíî, à ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðû,îïðåäåëÿþùèå êñåíîí âî âäûõàåìîé ïàöèåíòîì ãàçîâîé ñìåñè ó Âàñ èìåþòñÿ?
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #25  
Ñòàðûé 09.11.2005, 13:16
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Red face Äóéòå â òðóáêó áîëüíîé

Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò pandoc
Çàíèìàòüñÿ òî çàíèìàþòñÿ,òîëüêî íå íà ëþäÿõ.Íà ëþäÿõ êñåíîí ïîêà áîëüøå íèãäå íå èñïîëüçóþò,êðîìå êàê â Ðîññèè.Ïðè÷åì òåõíè÷åñêèé,ïðÿìî îò ñòàëåâàðîb.Èíòåðåñíî, à ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðû,îïðåäåëÿþùèå êñåíîí âî âäûõàåìîé ïàöèåíòîì ãàçîâîé ñìåñè ó Âàñ èìåþòñÿ?
Íó óæ ýòî âû ìàõíóëè, ìû æå çäåñü íå äîïîòîïíûå ìàìîíòû. Òåõíè÷åñêèé íåïðèãîäåí äëÿ ìåäèöèíñêèõ öåëåé, ñëèøêîì ìíîãî ïðèìåñåé + èçîòîïû âñÿêèå, ðàäèîàêòèâíûå, ìîãóò áûòü. Òåõíè÷åñêèé ïðåäâàðèòåëüíî î÷èùàþò. À âîò íà ñ÷åò ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðîâ, ýòî ÿ óçíàþ. Õîðîøèé âîïðîñ.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #26  
Ñòàðûé 14.11.2005, 13:13
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Öèòàòà:
Pandoc:... Íà ëþäÿõ êñåíîí ïîêà áîëüøå íèãäå íå èñïîëüçóþò,êðîìå êàê â Ðîññèè....
Òåïåðü è íåìöû: Êñåíîí â Ãåðìàíèè
[Ññûëêè äîñòóïíû òîëüêî çàðåãèñòðèðîâàííûì ïîëüçîâàòåëÿì ]
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #27  
Ñòàðûé 14.11.2005, 14:29
Hazards Hazards âíå ôîðóìà Ïîë ìóæñêîé
Êàíäèäàò â ó÷àñòíèêè, íå ïîäòâåðäèâøèé ðåãèñòðàöèþ
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 08.11.2005
Ãîðîä: Ìîñêâà
Ñîîáùåíèé: 9
Hazards *
Red face

Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò pandoc
Çàíèìàòüñÿ òî çàíèìàþòñÿ,òîëüêî íå íà ëþäÿõ.Íà ëþäÿõ êñåíîí ïîêà áîëüøå íèãäå íå èñïîëüçóþò,êðîìå êàê â Ðîññèè.Ïðè÷åì òåõíè÷åñêèé,ïðÿìî îò ñòàëåâàðîb.Èíòåðåñíî, à ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðû,îïðåäåëÿþùèå êñåíîí âî âäûõàåìîé ïàöèåíòîì ãàçîâîé ñìåñè ó Âàñ èìåþòñÿ?
Ïîõîæå, èìåþòñÿ: "Ãàçîàíàëèçàòîð êîìáèíèðîâàííûé ìåäèöèíñêèé ÃÊÌ-03-ÈÍÑÎÂÒ ïðåäíàçíà÷åí äëÿ èçìåðåíèÿ îáú¸ìíîé äîëè êèñëîðîäà è âòîðîãî êîìïîíåíòà – êñåíîíà âî âðåìÿ ïðîâåäåíèÿ êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè. Ãàçîàíàëèçàòîð âûäà¸ò òðåâîæíûå çâóêîâûå è ñâåòîâûå ñèãíàëû: àâàðèéíûå "Î2 < 20% " è "Xe > 80%" è ïðåäóïðåæäàþùèå "ÌÀËÎ Î2" è "ÌÍÎÃÎ Õå"". Âçÿòî îòñþäà _http://akela.ru/nark_prist_med_equipment.html
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #28  
Ñòàðûé 15.11.2005, 05:02
pandoc
Ãîñòü
 
Ñîîáùåíèé: n/a
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò Hazards
Ïîõîæå, èìåþòñÿ: "Ãàçîàíàëèçàòîð êîìáèíèðîâàííûé ìåäèöèíñêèé ÃÊÌ-03-ÈÍÑÎÂÒ ïðåäíàçíà÷åí äëÿ èçìåðåíèÿ îáú¸ìíîé äîëè êèñëîðîäà è âòîðîãî êîìïîíåíòà – êñåíîíà âî âðåìÿ ïðîâåäåíèÿ êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè. Ãàçîàíàëèçàòîð âûäà¸ò òðåâîæíûå çâóêîâûå è ñâåòîâûå ñèãíàëû: àâàðèéíûå "Î2 < 20% " è "Xe > 80%" è ïðåäóïðåæäàþùèå "ÌÀËÎ Î2" è "ÌÍÎÃÎ Õå"". Âçÿòî îòñþäà _http://akela.ru/nark_prist_med_equipment.html
 ïîñëåäíåì íîìåðå European Journal of Anaesthesiology åñòü ñòàòüÿ "Patien's self evaluation after 4-12 weeks following xenon or propofol anaesthesia:a comparison"
Àâòîðû:M.Coburn.O.Kunitz,J.-H.Baumert,K.Hecker,R.Rossaint (University Hospital of Aachen,Germany.Aâòîðû ïðîâåëè èññëåäîâàíèå íà 80 ïàöèåíòàõ ñ èñïîëüçîâàíèåì êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè.Êîìïàíèÿ -ïðîèçâîäèòåëü ìåäèöèíñêîãî êñåíîíà -Messer-Grieshheim GmbH.Xenon áûë èñïîëüçîâàí ïî çàêðûòîìó êîíòóðó àíåñòåçèîëîãè÷åñêîãî àïïàðàòà (machine) Physioflex,Draeger ñ ìîäèôèöèðîâàííûì software äëÿ óìåíüøåíèÿ ðàñõîäà êñåíîíà ïðè óñëîâèè ìèíèìàëüíîãî ïîòîêà ñâåæåãî ãàçà.Êîíöåíòðàöèÿ êñåíîíà âî âäûõàåìîé ñìåñè îïðåäåëÿëàñü ñ ïîìîùüþ óñòðîéñòâà,îñíîâàííîãî íà îïðåäåëåíèè òåïëîïðîâîäíîñòè ãàçîâ âäûõàåìîé ñìåñè.Òî÷íîñòü îïåäåëåíèÿ +/- 3 îáüåìíûõ ïðîöåíòà.Ïîñêîëüêó êñåíîí-èíåðòíûé ãàç,òî îáû÷íûå ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðû,èñïîëüçóþùèå ïîëÿðèçóþùèå ñâîéñòâà ìîëåêóë âñåõ äðóãèõ ãàçîâ(êèñëîðîäà,óãëåêèñëîãî ãàçà,çàêèñè àçîòà è èñïàðÿåìûõ èíãàëÿöèîííûõ àíåñòåòèêîâ)äëÿ äåòåêöèè èõ êîíöåíòðàöèè,íå â ñîñòîÿíèè îïðåäåëèòü íàëè÷èå êñåíîíà âî âäûõàåìîû/âûäûõàåìîé ñìåñè.Ïîýòîìó,îñíîâíûì óñëîâèåì àäåêâàòíîãî îïðåäåëåíèÿ êîíöåíòðàöèè ñ ïîìîùüþ òåðìîêîíäóêòèâíîãî äàò÷èêà ÿâëÿåòñÿ äåíèòîãåíèçàöèÿ äûõàòåëüíîãî êîíòóðà,ïóòåì ïðåîêñèãåíàöèè ïàöèåíòà äëÿ óäàëåíèÿ àçîòà âîçäóõà.Èíà÷å äàò÷èê áóäåò îøèáî÷íî îïðåäåëÿòü àçîò êàê êñåíîí.
Àíåñòåçèÿ ïîääåðæèâàëàñü ñìåñüþ 60% êñåíîíà â êèñëîðîäå.
Àâòîðû óòâåðæäàþò,÷òî ðåçóëüòàòû êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè íå îòëè÷àþòñÿ ïî ñâîèì ïîñëåîïåðàöîííûì ýôôåêòàì îò ïðîïîôîëîâî/ðåìèôåíòàíèëîâîé àíåñòåçèè.
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #29  
Ñòàðûé 15.11.2005, 05:18
papadoctor papadoctor âíå ôîðóìà ÂÐÀ×
Êàíäèäàò â âåòåðàíû ôîðóìà
      
 
Ðåãèñòðàöèÿ: 27.03.2005
Ãîðîä: USA
Ñîîáùåíèé: 1,685
Ïîáëàãîäàðèëè 1 ðàç çà 1 ñîîáùåíèå
papadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìåpapadoctor ýòîò ó÷àñòíèê èìååò ïðåâîñõîäíóþ ðåïóòàöèþ íà ôîðóìå
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò pandoc
 ïîñëåäíåì íîìåðå European Journal of Anaesthesiology åñòü ñòàòüÿ "Patien's self evaluation after 4-12 weeks following xenon or propofol anaesthesia:a comparison"
Àâòîðû:M.Coburn.O.Kunitz,J.-H.Baumert,K.Hecker,R.Rossaint (University Hospital of Aachen,Germany.Aâòîðû ïðîâåëè èññëåäîâàíèå íà 80 ïàöèåíòàõ ñ èñïîëüçîâàíèåì êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè.Êîìïàíèÿ -ïðîèçâîäèòåëü ìåäèöèíñêîãî êñåíîíà -Messer-Grieshheim GmbH.Xenon áûë èñïîëüçîâàí ïî çàêðûòîìó êîíòóðó àíåñòåçèîëîãè÷åñêîãî àïïàðàòà (machine) Physioflex,Draeger ñ ìîäèôèöèðîâàííûì software äëÿ óìåíüøåíèÿ ðàñõîäà êñåíîíà ïðè óñëîâèè ìèíèìàëüíîãî ïîòîêà ñâåæåãî ãàçà.Êîíöåíòðàöèÿ êñåíîíà âî âäûõàåìîé ñìåñè îïðåäåëÿëàñü ñ ïîìîùüþ óñòðîéñòâà,îñíîâàííîãî íà îïðåäåëåíèè òåïëîïðîâîäíîñòè ãàçîâ âäûõàåìîé ñìåñè.Òî÷íîñòü îïåäåëåíèÿ +/- 3 îáüåìíûõ ïðîöåíòà.Ïîñêîëüêó êñåíîí-èíåðòíûé ãàç,òî îáû÷íûå ãàçîàíàëèçàòîðû,èñïîëüçóþùèå ïîëÿðèçóþùèå ñâîéñòâà ìîëåêóë âñåõ äðóãèõ ãàçîâ(êèñëîðîäà,óãëåêèñëîãî ãàçà,çàêèñè àçîòà è èñïàðÿåìûõ èíãàëÿöèîííûõ àíåñòåòèêîâ)äëÿ äåòåêöèè èõ êîíöåíòðàöèè,íå â ñîñòîÿíèè îïðåäåëèòü íàëè÷èå êñåíîíà âî âäûõàåìîû/âûäûõàåìîé ñìåñè.Ïîýòîìó,îñíîâíûì óñëîâèåì àäåêâàòíîãî îïðåäåëåíèÿ êîíöåíòðàöèè ñ ïîìîùüþ òåðìîêîíäóêòèâíîãî äàò÷èêà ÿâëÿåòñÿ äåíèòîãåíèçàöèÿ äûõàòåëüíîãî êîíòóðà,ïóòåì ïðåîêñèãåíàöèè ïàöèåíòà äëÿ óäàëåíèÿ àçîòà âîçäóõà.Èíà÷å äàò÷èê áóäåò îøèáî÷íî îïðåäåëÿòü àçîò êàê êñåíîí.
Àíåñòåçèÿ ïîääåðæèâàëàñü ñìåñüþ 60% êñåíîíà â êèñëîðîäå.
Àâòîðû óòâåðæäàþò,÷òî ðåçóëüòàòû êñåíîíîâîé àíåñòåçèè íå îòëè÷àþòñÿ ïî ñâîèì ïîñëåîïåðàöîííûì ýôôåêòàì îò ïðîïîôîëîâî/ðåìèôåíòàíèëîâîé àíåñòåçèè.
À ïî÷åìó íåëüçÿ èñïîëüçîâàòü ìàññ-ñïåêòðîìåòð
Îòâåòèòü ñ öèòèðîâàíèåì
  #30  
Ñòàðûé 15.11.2005, 06:53
pandoc
Ãîñòü
 
Ñîîáùåíèé: n/a
Öèòàòà:
Ñîîáùåíèå îò papadoctor
À ïî÷åìó íåëüçÿ èñïîëüçîâàòü ìàññ-ñïåêòðîìåòð
Anaesthesia
Online Early
doi:10.1111/j.1365-2044.2005.04379.x
Volume 0 Issue 0


APPARATUS
Xenon measurement in breathing systems: a comparison of ultrasonic and thermal conductivity methods
R. King1, M. Bretland1, A. Wilkes2 and J. Dingley1
Summary

Xenon is an anaesthetic and possibly neuroprotective gas that is impossible to measure using conventional anaesthetic gas analysers. We compared the performance of two commissioned xenon analysers using ultrasonic and thermal conductivity principles against a reference method of laser refractometry. An experimental gas circuit was constructed and xenon concentrations compared over a range of 0–100% in oxygen. Eighty-two paired measurements were made comparing the experimental methods with laser refractometry. The ultrasonic method displayed good agreement with laser refractometry, with a mean difference of − 0.74% and two standard deviation limits of agreement of + 1.08% to − 2.56%. The agreement between laser refractometry and thermal conductivity was poor, the mean difference being − 5.37%, with two standard deviation limits of agreement of + 0.6% to − 11.3%. The ultrasonic method for measuring xenon concentrations can be used in breathing circuits. The thermal conductivity instrument may need further development





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Recent developments
Xenon is Greek for stranger. It was discover in 1898 and found to be the only noble gas to be anaesthetic under normobaric conditions. Xenon is extremely scarce with an average room containing only 4ml.

Manufacture is by fractional distillation of air and costs 2000 times more than N2O.

Commercial uses include lasers, high intensity lamps, flash bulbs, aerospace, X-ray tubes and medicine.

Physical properties

Colourless, odourless, tasteless.
Monatomic gas, atomic number = 54, molecular weight = 131,3
Gas undr normal temperature and pressure
9 stable isotopes.
Freezing point -111,9oC, Boiling point -108,1oC.
4 times more dense than air.
Nonflammable and will not support combustion.
Diffuses freely through rubber and silicone components.
Anaesthetic agent

First used in 1951 by Cullen on an 81yr old man having an orchidectomy..
Very close to the ‘ideal agent’
The very large electron shell of xenon ca be distorted and polarised by nearby molecules, creating a dipole.
Xenon inhibits the plasma membrane Ca2+ pump, altering excitability. It inhibits the nociceptive responsiveness of spinal dorsal horn neurons.
MAC = 71%. (With more widespread usage the Russians have noticed the MAC to be closer to 60%)
Minimal haemodynamic effects.
Lowest blood/gas partition coefficient = 0,115 of currently available inhalational agents.
Low oil/water partition co-efficient of 20.
Rapid induction and eduction regardless of duration of administration
4 stages of anaesthesia noted with 70% Xenon/ 30% oxygen.
Whole body paraesthesia & hypo-algesia.
Euphoria & increased psychomotor activity.
Analgesia with partial amnesia (after 3-4min).
Surgical anaesthesia with a degree of muscle relaxation.
Equivalent analgesia when compared with equipotent doses of N2O The analgesia produced by both gases is not reversible by naloxone.
No occupational/ environmental disadvantages.
Specific effects on the body

Respiratory
Central depression causes a decrease in respiratory rate with a compensatory increase in tidal volume and can progress to apnoea
Higher density and viscosity (compared with oxygen, air and N2O) theoretically makes xenon more likely to increase airway resistance. Clinically the airway resistance is slightly less than that seen with N2O and it can be used safely in lung disease
Diffusion hypoxia is very mild as the blood/gas partition of Nitrogen (0.014) is only 10 times less than that of Xenon (0.14) as opposed to the almost 40 times less than Nitrous Oxide (0.47)
Cardiovascular
No inhibitory effects on cardiac ion channels i.e. calcium, sodium and inward potassium channels.
No significant change in contractility, blood pressure and systemic resistance.
Some reports of decrease in heart rate with variability in rhythm.
No sensitisation of the myocardium to adrenaline
May attenuate the myocardial depressant effects of isoflurane.
In an animal study, xenon anaesthesia produced the highest regional blood flow to brain, liver, kidneys and GIT. The control groups were 1% halothane in Nitrous oxide and thiopentone with fentanyl.
Central nervous system
Xenon increases cerebral blood flow, increases intracranial pressure and decreases cerebral perfusion pressure in acute head injury patients. This is not associated with cerebral oligaemia or ischaemia.
This increase in cerebral blood flow is reveresed by mild hyperventilation
At present it is not recommended for neurosurgery.
Renal
No data available.
Endocrine/neurohumoral
Attenuates surgical stress due to analgesia. Does not have any short or long term cortisol suppresion effects.
Toxicity
Platelet aggregation potentiated at 2atm (relevant to deep-sea divers).
No reported haematological toxicity.
Malignant hyperthermia
Seems not to trigger malignant hyperthermia.
Metabolism and elimination
Unlikely to be involved in any biochemical events in the body.
Eliminated via the lungs.
Under special conditions xenon is capable of forming compounds with very reactive elements e.g. clathrates, fluorides & chlorides
Potential ways to make xenon anaesthesia economically acceptable.

Decreasing manufacturing costs.
This is only practical in large air separation plants.
Current price is 10 US$/ litre
Manufacture will increase as aerospace applications grow, but as this xenon is then lost to the atmosphere this will not contribute to decreasing the cost.
Use in a fully closed breathing system
Use of semiclosed systems (facemasks/LMA/spontaneous breathing) cost £1200/hr.
Very low flow e.g. 0,3 l/min will cost £160-180/hr.
Fully closed automated systems are available that are suitable for xenon anaesthesia
Gas piston circle
physioflex device
Balanced circle systems.
Circle priming
Recycling devices are the only way of guaranteeing the availability of a sufficient amount of xenon for routine clinical use.
Gas analysis
Xenon can be measured with mass spectrometry, piezoelectric absorption, thermal conductivity and ultra-sound.
Practical use

Nitrogen must be washed out by giving a high flow of pure oxygen for at least 5 minutes
Normal induction and muscle relaxation
After intubation connect the patient to an appropriate anaesthesia delivery system
The hypnotic concentration of 40-45% is achieved after 1.5min
The anaesthetic concentration of 60-70% takes approximately 8 minutes.
Summary

Colourless and odourless gas with no irritation to the respiratory tract. Well tolerated with gas induction
Low blood/gas and oil/water partition co-efficients allowing rapid induction and eduction
Produces unconsciousness with analgesia and a degree of muscle relaxation
MAC of 60-70% allows a reasonable inspired oxygen concentration
It does cause respiratory depression, to the point of apnoea.
It is cardiac stable.
Not metabolised in the body and is eliminated rapidly and completely via the lungs.
It is non toxic and is not associated with allergic reactions
Stable in storage, no interaction with anaesthesia circuits or soda lime. Should not be used with rubber anaesthesia circuits as there is a high loss through the rubber
Non flammable
Expensive - Routine usage will only be possible with a closed circuit delivery system that recycles xenon.
Owing to environmental concerns there may be no alternative but to use xenon even if it incurs an increase in cost.
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